Would Like Opinions on Confirmation, Please - Page 1

I'm trying to develop my eye for confirmation, and would like people to take a look at this dog. He's a rescue I was given by an idiot who kept him on an 8 ft. chain 24/7, and was planning to shoot him when he didn't turn out to be a good enough watchdog. (He was expected to bark at family members and even the neighbour who came to feed him when the owner was away.) Anyway, here is a link to the photos. The first two are from his former home, and that chain is a thing of the past. This is just an academic exercise, because he's been neutered, and has no papers anyway. Any thoughts as to his lines? I'm thinking German x American because he doesn't have a roached back, and he's not overangulated either. He's a very confident dog, is not scared of thunder or gunfire or strangers. He got out the other day due to frost heaving the gate, and held my postie at bay for a couple of minutes, until I came to rescue her. He made no effort to bite, but he certainly was not going to let her up on the porch to deliver the mail, either. I now have a lock on the gate... http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a344/Sunsilver/RalphSmall1.jpg http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a344/Sunsilver/Ralph2Small.jpg http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a344/Sunsilver/Ranger_head.jpg

He looks just like a female rescue I have. My daughters dog actaully. I would be interested in what people say about this as well...

You mean he's got no balls? [snicker!] I assure you, that wasn't the case when I adopted him... ;-)

I would say he is from working lines and say likely not any American in him. He has more of the old style conformation and a nice head.

When you say old style confirmation, I'm guessing you mean before the German dogs all had banana toplines. So, he is more similar in structure to the really old lines, the foundation dogs of the breed? Since no one seems to want to comment on his confirmation, I'll have a go at it: Excellent bone, good strong legs and feet, nice masculine head. Good length to back, (correct proportion of length to height.) Nice rich pigment of coat. Weaknesses: eye could be a bit darker. American Shepherd fans will tell you he doesn't have enough angulation. German show/working fans will say he needs to have a roach in his back. I say both groups need to take a good, hard look at the foundation dogs again. Teeth suffering from severe premature wear, points worn off canines, due to dog's habit of playing with rocks. (If you're dumb as a brick owner has you chained to a pile of rocks and sand 24 hours a day, what ELSE are you going to play with??)

I would agree with the no American in him. Nice to see a GSD not walking on his hocks. Nice head.

First, please indulge a pet peeve. The word is conformation. That means, how well does the dog conform to(compare to, measure up to)the breed standard. The word is not confirmation. Second, the effort to develop your "eye" for conformation is to be praised. The process is long and subtle. There is no substitute for standing ring-side at shows and breed surveys and listening critically to what the judges and breed masters are saying. If you want to learn what these experts are evaluating, listen, look, listen and look again. Study pictures, study movement, train dogs and learn about working drives. Any critique should start with the positive. This dog has very nice pigmentation, with an alert, correct ear set. The following general impressions are based on candid photos that are not presented to illustrate accurate anatomical attributes. (In other words, the picture needs to show the dog in such a way that the relevant anatomical parts can be clearly seen.) Part of developing your "eye" is to learn how to present the dog to the judge. Short, steep upper arm. Short, steep croup. Straight rear angulation. Weak, splayed feet and pasterns. Normal head. Normal "Gepraege" (secondary sex characteristics, or, in this case, masculinity). Medium size, medium powerful (based on relative size to the dog house). Short, steep croup. Normal wither. Slightly stretched. Past this impression, a judge would look at the movement of the dog. Some dogs with less than perfect forehands and/or rear-hands, nevertheless, move extremely well. They are "performers" and trade on their innate showmanship. Impressions of lineage: No American show line. No European show line. American working lines only.

Thank you gck. I know it's hard to judge accurately from a less than ideal photo. The dog's feet are normal. They are splayed because he was standing on soft sand. You did a good job of guessing the size. He seems to stand about 25" tall, as near as I can judge without someone else to help measure him. This was the first time I had laid eyes on the dog, so getting him properly posed wasn't an option. He went ballistic at the sight of me, and I was lucky to get those two semi-posed candids. And since I live alone, it's been difficult to get a more formal, correctly posed picture of him. When you say 'slightly stretched', what do you mean by that? His back is a bit too long?

American working line now thats funny.

Slightly stretched would mean... could have a shorter back. The length to height proportions and the longer topline should consist of a long high wither (shoulder blades)+ comparatively short back (Should be straight) and a long and correctly angulated CROUPE... which is being contested for working ability saying a long kruppe will diminish drive... Working lines tend to have broader pelvices and shorter and steep croups they say coupled with a high raised tail set may have very high drives... acc to the Shawlein site. A long back with poor withers is a No No of course. BANANA backs are produced when a well anglated croup + short back that is not level is COUPLED with FLAT mutton-like withers (underdeveloped) You will notice working class dogs (ROTTs and Dobes etc..) have a very distinct withers which I am looking for in a GSD although having a pronounced WITHER may sometimes appear not to have a straight back... If anyone can show me how to develop the wither muscles ..I would apppreciate it very much... Chao Marci.. Striving for the GOLDEN MIDDLE