Are civil dogs often hardheaded and unsuitable for Law enforcement? - Page 4

A confident person would not feel the need to respond to childish remarks.

Don't worry about who needs to be banned it is in my job description

Well obviously you aren't doing your job...CLOWN!

NeinNein it is not up to you to decide who should be banned 

I did use my energy to train dogs. USA Conformation Champions, yep. USA obedience, Yep. Can. Conformation Champions, yep. Canadian obedience, yep.

German Dogs, titled, KKL and recertified at proper time. yep at public trial

no matter how much it offends some people, there are people in the world who have done things with the GSD other than post on an internet board.

best,
Rik

Baren
Rudie pegge was a legend in the knpv world. This trainer is in the bizz for a long time and to claim that he cannot recognize a fear biter is dubious. He explicitly says the behavior Is genetic and the dogs can take pressue as well.

 

No names were named and I wasn't even talking about Rudie Pegge. 

I was talking about a lot of people who mistake fear aggression for civil dogs. Just like, on this very topic, handler aggression is mistaken for civil dogs. In no way did I say "Rudie Pegge can't tell the difference between a fear biter and a civil dog."  ;)

I really wish people would enable the editor and use the quote function. It would make reading posts so much easier.

 

Duke 1965 wrote:

it got to do with level of possesiveness

 

Which would not even be an issue if the dog realized who the boss was.

 

When I first started in Schutzhund, a German trainer told me that the most important thing is that the dog knows you are the boss and ALWAYS the boss. Many owners have the idea that they are the boss when in fact they are not. Proof: A dog that just obeys some of the time (or just some commands).

 

Let me see if I can find a rolling eye smiley for this...ah, here: 

This is possession! It's actually a good thing.

 

@Duke: My new female, I'm pretty sure that you can appreciate this one

Just for refresher, here's the topic - 

Are civil dogs often hardheaded and unsuitable for Law enforcement? 

Here's my take on this, for what it's worth.    I consider 'hard-headed' to be a measure of biddability.  In other words, how tractable and compliant is the dog to working FOR the handler.   Is the dog reluctant to do what he is asked, needing 'incentive' to comply or is the dog a willing worker?    This biddability is not related to being 'civil', defined by myself as the trait of the dog to respond aggressively to a person whom the dog sees as posing a threat.   The level of threat as seen by the dog and the 'trigger' for an aggressive response is a function of genetic inheretance at its core, and can be manipulated by training.   One of these traits in the dog does not mean the other is going to be there - they are not mutually inclusive.    I would say that civil dogs can be very suitable for law enforcement, provided they receive the training and handling that keeps the general public safe and the dog under control.

Barenfangs
I really did not want to call you out on this one..but Rudie Pegge is a dog ( a legendary DS ) not a person.

No Shit,   People know Hans Pegge and what he produced! I wasn't referring to a person either.

It seems as though these no nonsense dogs are showing up more in the KNPV dutch mali crosses and possibly such traits are long gone from the current working GSDs . Even the so called civil Athos.

 

If you think those traits are gone from the GSD you don't know the GSD!