Would you have bred these dogs? - Page 5

In the case of the dog in question, quite a bit of emphasis appears to have gone into working temperament, with such noted producers of correct temperament Cim vom Ecknachtal, Cello von der Romerau, and the noch zugelassen Gundo vom Trienzbachtal in the pedigree on the sire line, all of which go back to Mutz von der Pelztierfarm. The mother line on the bottom also goes back to Mutz. Mutz was a noted producer of working ability and solid temperament. The Mutz line is relatively rare in today's showlines, and there is a need for some alternative lines to get beyond the potential Jeck-Ursus bottleneck and also to enhance weak temperament that is said to sometimes pop up in the Dux della Vulcavia-Zamp Thermodos line. Also, the dogs were evaluated under the FCI system, where a "C" grade is roughly equivalent to the SV "noch zugelassen" or "still permissible." Further, there is no evidence anywhere that any of these dogs were the slightest bit compromised by their hips. The ultimate issue is that while hips are important, they aren't everything. If breeders start worrying solely about hip production and ignore everything else, then they will just wind up with the same thing the Ambred dog has become: a dog largely bred for one characteristic of the breed (side gait) that has in many instances resulted in the loss of other necessary characteristics that make up the total German Shepherd as most of us conceive the breed. Finally, while my personal preference might be for fewer "NZ"-type hips in the dog's pedigree, it's a bit much to attack the breeder the way some here have.

And Brittany, before stating so emphatically that the folks who bred this dog should "be ashamed" and then posting comments to that effect under the dog's parents, you might want to check out your Zambi's pedigree: on the top of the sire line, the great-grand-sire Visum von Arminius was fast normal and was bred to a noch zugelassen bitch to produce Zambi's grandsire. Should the breeder of the grandsire "be ashamed" to have bred those dogs? Should the breeder of Zambi "be ashamed" to have the product of such a breeding contributing one-quarter of Zambi's genetics? Are you "ashamed" that you in essence encouraged the continuation of such breeding by buying Zambi? And do you like it when people criticize Zambi's appearance? If not, then why did you find it necessary to make your gratuitous crack about one of the parents being "pet quality"? It's precisely this sort of thing that causes people to lose patience with you. If you'd stop worrying about being such a "defender of the breed" and using that as a justification to smear people whom you don't know from a hole in the wall and instead started thinking more about the impact of your words, you'd earn a lot more respect.

p59teitel, Your post about Mutz and hips in general is ON POINT! I owned a bitch out of a Meik vd Peltierferm daughter (Mutz'z brother. Meik stayed in Germany and Mutz went to Italy) and Jack von Furstenberg(Marko vom Cellerland son).Both of these males were V in conformation and Sch111 FH, when it meant somthing. My bitch was a great dog but Sch was in its infancy here in the US, so I didn't get to compete with her. Hips were great and I honestly feel that if Germany would have left these two dogs (Marko and Mutz) in prominent roles in the evolution of the showlines we wouldn't be in the shape that midnight trials was even a word.

Imagine the value your bitch would have today, with Marko's line essentially gone and Mutz's line available pretty much only through the Cello-Eros-Huppy-Hill lineage...

I woudl have to agree that the pedigree's on here are NOT always correct, and can be changed at will! :-( But what can one do if they know a pedigree is wrong and it won't let you make the correct changes to it?