How would you improve the GSD of today? - Page 4

Lots of wonderful points made, I will make mine brief- Separating working and show lines is dissecting the breed and in my opinion, not good for the breed.The GSD should both look good and work, and demostrate versatality in several phases of work- if not Schutzhund, some other sport that demonstrates that this breed is capable of multi-tasking.Eliminating or containing genetically transmitted diseases (as stephen pointed out) will happen at some point as science progresses- and lots of people are working on it as we speak- but I don't see lots of people working on producing good looking dogs that can work and vice versa-both are equally important.

This article by Carmen Battaglia may be of interest to some. It is part 1 of a 2 part feature in "Canine Chronicle" magazine. I assume the rest will be on the net next month. http://www.caninechronicle.com/features/battaglia_06/battaglia_506.html

Chris, I don't think the BH is a measurable indicator of character or a true test of temperament. My take on it was more as a prelim exhibit to show basic control.

Should I not take him for walks? He would love that. My husband and I have been taking him to an open grassy knoll near by that he likes a lot. Also, his vet said he should meet 100 new people every week because he's not a very friendly puppy. He's not MEAN, he just isn't interested in other humans, so to speak. Sigh

Blitzen I hope that my postings won't be percived as coming from some kind of Trojan Horse type person. I am not advocating the reduction in numbers just a reduction in the amount of dogs who look good but can't work. It's a funny thing but if I see a dog enter the training ground I often think,Wow that looks great. If it fails to impress with it's working it then starts to look worse. On the other hand if a dog has great working abilities it starts to look real nice. Best Chris

Rebel/Gooner/Sport Dog I used the example of SchH3 qualification since it is a currently established tool in the breed qualification process. I agree that other lines of work measurements exist and if so they should be used, (just like the HGH title is being done now), as long as the work is grade-able and quantifiable. Justifiably institution measures that raise the bar has to be phased in (as implied by Gooner). Appropriate “grandfather” clauses can be structured that would not adversely impact currently qualified sires and dams. Criteria can be progressively made more stringent over a period of time. One example using the SchH3 theme I proposed earlier could conceivably be requiring a minimum score of 240 under 2 separate judges. Then 5 years later it would be a score of 255 and then 270 after another 5 years. Similar criteria of stringency could be drafted for other measurable standards of work. This would give breeders opportunity to get their act together. On the other hand it would also give breed organizations time to evaluate the impact of the move as well as make appropriate modifications to manage the gaming of the new system that is bound to occur as a manifestation of human behavior.

I would do several things: 1. Crack down hard on oversized dogs, put more medium sized dogs on the VA list. 2. Change the kennel championship lists to include some other scoring mechanisms. For instance, more points for a breeder who has dogs working as patrol and detection dogs. 3. Put at least one workingline GSD as VA every year. Asko van der Lutter maybe? 4. Allow for Artificial insemination to protect important genetics, but limit its usage to approved circumstances 5. Limit the number of breedings per year by one stud 6. Open up the stud-book for Mali/Dutch Shepherd lines for health and working considerations. After 3 generations the progeny can be registed by the SV. 7. No dog goes VA until it has a track record of working progeny. In other words, several dogs working as patrol/K9 dogs. If a dog hasn't produced a dog that can work on the street, should we consider it for breeding at all? 8. Change Schutzhund to something more like the ring-sports. Add a suit and allow the decoy to put REAL pressure on the dog. I saw a workingline GSD at a French ring trial pushed into avoidance by low to moderate pressure 2 weeks ago and just about got sick! This also has the benefit of improving the agility and quickness of the breeding. Too many GSD's are too bulky and too slow to catch a moving target who is trying to make them miss. 9. Break the color barrier in conformation shows. It limits the dogs that can win and is further narrowing the blood lines. Other than that, the general ideas around health and looks - breeding toward a balanced dog that can handle physical and mental stress. --Alan

A quick comment on the Sch III requirement for both parents: Malinois breeders in France rarely title their females, because of the time required. However, they are also very critical about the working ability of the female and will take the female out of the program if they don't produce the working ability they want. A good compromise might be to require a tougher Sch III for the males (as I suggest above, something more similar to ringsport tests) and not require a title for the female other than some basic temperment test. The key is to force the breeder to make judgements about working ability beyond passing the current test. If a breeder knows that to make VA he has to produce a dog that can produce a number of serious dogs that work on the street, they'll do that.

I would get rid of 10% of the owners. I go to the GSD Club of Minneapolis and my puppy is the ONLY European bred GSD there. The woman who runs the place is a "breeder" and most of the people there have dogs from her litters. Well, let's just say they're not the highest quality dogs. She's bred over-sized, non-registered, "pure bred" GSDs. It's hard for my husband and I to even sit through it. However, the trainer herself is great. She loves the German bred dogs and is a good trainer. However, it's sickening to see some of these dogs' temperments and structures. So, I would improve the breed by improving the breeder.

Hi, Just a though i would also work on the coat of the GSD. I would allow longer coated dogs but not with too long of a coat like for example a collie's length. The SCHIII would have to be a must and all dogs no matter where they come from who there parents are or who the breeder is where they were baught must have their hips checked and there parents hips and the siblings. And if any of the dogs produce bad hips nore than once the dog should be taken out of the breeding program! Jess