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by jletcher18 on 09 November 2009 - 04:11
actions speak loader than words.
the problem i see,,,, somehow this does impact USCA ( why do so many people leave out the C?) they change the rules again. people go back. nothing learned, nothing gained. 5 years from now, its something new.
Clubs dont change the breed. Breeders do.
john
by Mr.GSD on 09 November 2009 - 15:11
A friend alerted me to this discussion, and I don't know if my reply will be accepted, as I'm not a "member" of chat lists. However, as a retired SV Zuchtrichter and former member of UScA, WDA, and GSDCA, I hope you'll let me put my 2 cents in.Excerpts from an e-mail I just sent, stimulated by the pulling out of the Dec. UScA breed show where I was going to handle a dozen entries or more:
I predict that unless the UScA does an about-turn to stop the bleeding, they will soon revert to the SchH-trial-only club that they were in the beginning. I remember when they had their first Sieger Shows, and everything looked promising. Then they dropped the ball and let the AKC club (GSDCA) step in front of them and get the WUSV membership! That was Johannes' first big dumb move on this particular matter. The next was having their Sieger Shows judged by non-SV judges. Now, the foot is in the mouth up to the kneecap! If that's the way they want to go, they will have to live with the consequences. They will lose member clubs, entries at breed events, and breeders.
Oh, well, for those of us who want to continue active in "the total dog" (breed shows included), I predict many more WDA affiliations will be seen. Meanwhile, for UScA clubs who were caught by this vote and will now lose the entries that would have paid their bills, I suggest immediately forming a WDA club under a different name and with officers' names shuffled around; and petitioning WDA to take over the planned breed-show events. Even if they have to use a different field than that used for trials.
Perhaps the DVG (Deutscher Verband der Gebrauchshundsportvereine, http://www.dvgamerica.com/ ) will be interested in taking up any slack that is bound to result in UScA's slippage. That is still a good venue for the SchH etc. sports people.
For the Total GSD and the sport,
Fred aka "Mr.GSD"
Fred Lanting, Willow Wood Consulting
by TessJ10 on 09 November 2009 - 15:11
When does this amendment take effect? Now? Jan. 1?
by Mr.GSD on 09 November 2009 - 15:11
Well, I gave it a try. Guess DVG is not an alternative. In the South and some other regions (Lyda mentioned her midwest expanse of geography), clubs and events are a great distance away. I hope WDA sets up an enticing invitatio to UScA clubs to jump ship and establish WDA clubs in these vacuum areas.
Here's DVG's reply: The name Fred Lanting is known throughout the dog world for devotion to the German Shepherd. However, DVG America is not interested in "picking up the slack" from disaffected USCA clubs. DVG is an _all-breed_ _sport dog _organization that allows non-registered mixed breed dogs to participate in any and all events, including our championships and including representing our LV in the DVG BSP and the dhv DM, should they qualify, in Germany. One of the requirements for clubs requesting membership in DVG America is that _any and all_ breeds and mixed breeds are accepted in the club and must be so stated in the club's by-laws. There is no such thing as an individual member of DVG. You can't make application to the DVG office to become an at-large member of DVG. Individuals achieve DVG membership only as members of _member clubs_ of DVG and acceptance of an application to become a member club is decided
upon by the region in which the club is located. Acceptance is not automatic.
DVG America has had a cordial relationship with the USCA since the late 70's, one that has become even closer since DVG America became a member of AWDF. Any group of people wishing to enjoy the sport of Schutzhund (or Vielseitigkeitspruefung fuer Gebrauchshunde as it is known in DVG) to develop good working dogs and enjoy a working relationship with their dogs is welcome. But any group wishing to form a DVG America club for the sole purpose of thumbing their collective noses at USCA is not. We are a sport club. And opening our clubs up to any and all disaffected USCA members, thus embroiling DVG America in this political mess, is not a path we wish to follow.
Carole Patterson, President LV/DVG America
Fred, aka "Mr.GSD"
by Kim Gash on 09 November 2009 - 18:11
In WDA you can compete with any breed in a trial up to the national level. Obviouly in shows or koerungs you cannot as that is breed specific. I beleive in GSDCA AKC events, and even in the last National Cup WDS competition, all breeds are welcome but preference will be given to the GSD if entries are limited.
I am really shocked if this is what Carole wrote because her husband Gary was one of the founders of WDA and another reason it is formed under Colorado law.
USA and DVG held together the SchH in this country for years as AKC would not accept it. Thank God they were there. But this is not a time for either one to become exclusive rather than inclusive, they have way too much time spent building great organziations. DVG is its own fiefdom as it owes its loyalty and membership only to DVG and is an LG of the DVG in Germany. None of these organizations can affect their teams to the Meisterschaft. Being a member of DVG does give a person the ability to compete at a USA trial though the membership in AWDF. This would I beleive circumvent the what club you were allowed to belong to and also allows a non USA member to compete for the AWDF team - again this all goes back to team qualifications.
by Silbersee on 09 November 2009 - 18:11
I read this reply to you from Mrs. Patterson and it saddens me that it is so negative. Yes, we all know that DVG is an organization that promotes dog sport and not breed related issues. It is also understood that DVG membership is only to be achieved through club memberships. But what Mrs. Patterson fails to see here is that the disenchantements are not only happening on an individual basis but whole clubs might want to defect. After all, most clubs usually are made up by training enthusiasts and not necessarily breeders. The ones whose membership comprises of breeders and/or show enthusiasts apparantly made their choice a while ago and stuck with WDA. Other breeds and mixed breeds have always been welcome in UScA and WDA clubs. This aspect should not be an issue. I hope that Mrs. Patterson will either read this discussion thread here or somebody will advise her to be a little bit more friendly and accommodating to dog sport people who are now trying to find a new home for training.
As Hodie stated, let's leave UScA now! Otherwise, it will not make an impact and the bullies won! It is so sad as we have been members for close to 17 years now!
Our membership renewal was due on November 1 but I had wanted to wait on the outcome of that meeting. Now, I will send my renewal card back voided with a farewell letter.
by Bob McKown on 09 November 2009 - 19:11
by judron55 on 09 November 2009 - 19:11
ron
by VomMarischal on 09 November 2009 - 19:11
by Kim Gash on 09 November 2009 - 19:11
The number of people that do not care and this has no effect on, far outweighs those who voted for this and those opposed to this. People just have to choose based on indignation (which usually wanes and goes by the wayside), or choose what club is closer, provides more venues they can go to etc. etc. or start a new club and have things their own way. The hardest choice will be for top sport handlers. But then again, to obtain the top dogs, USA may very well allow members to be a member one year, drop out the next, rejoin the next. Since no one has seen this yet in writing - not sure what it addresses in joining, not renewing, then rejoining.
I doubt the rule will change unless the people leaving would impact USA financially or on a presitge level for the team. I am sure they have looked at it and figured they will not lose that many clubs or members and can financially withstand it and have the people they want for the teams that are not going to bolt and lose a chance to be on that team. Just have to see how it works out for USA. The one thing they can count on is people hate to change, don't like change. Look at all the people in abusive relationships that don't leave, they keep thinking if they just work from within things will change, yet they get beat up everyday. Sometimes its just easier for someone to stay rather than deal with the unknown. For the most part, people are followers and there are very few leaders or independent people. Most like to belong and take the path of least resistance.
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