leukemia/lyphoma/lymphosarcoma??? - Page 2

"strides are made" with real science and studies that can be duplicated. Data must be gathered from reliablee sources and verified over and over. Most disease clusters have never been causally proven and yes, people believe what they want to hear, without regard for the facts. For example, I can say "gee, 8 kids in my neighborhood have illnesses. Even if some signs and symptoms are similar, and even if they are the same disease, I cannot simply assume a common cause. And when I jump to conclusions without real science behind my conclusions, in fact, I may have doomed the search for finding the real cause.

There is a tremendous amount of new literature on cancer causes and yes, some are genetic, some viral, possibly some related to other pathogens and some are related to environment. It does no good, however, when science is thwarted by unscientific studies and hearsay.

We would all like to believe that there is a cause for everything and that we can figure out the "environmental" or chemical trigger and never have it happen again. We also would like, as a society, to put blame on anything and everything when, in fact, sometimes life just comes down the road the wrong way and one gets mowed over. Unfortunately, the internet is becoming mostly known for the dissemination of rumor, junk science and pure BS. It is particularly sad when, indeed, there are wonderful tutorial sites on the internet that will help guide ones' study of the immune system, cancer, or whatever. It can be a much more fruitful experience to go start at the beginning and learn all there is about what is known than ask for data that may be nothing more than bunk, that is not verified, that is a very insignificant number in terms of data possible to collect, and for which the interpretation must be considered completely worthless.

It would be nice if a stiff course in the scientific method would be mandatory in this country. It would be even better if every citizen was required to study toxicology, biology, microbiology etc. And it would be a wonder should people refer to real science rather than simply see what they want to see, and hear what they want to hear. But I know that will never change in our society, and that is evidenced by how our nation continues to slip in the ranks of education in the world.

Anyone else care to contribute to this thread? Thanks..................

The really wonderful thing about scientific methodology is that, even if your hypothesis is not proven by your research/ experimentation/other studies, you still learn something. We sometimes learn more, & more valuable information, from what we weren't looking for, from failed hypothesis; than from what we label 'success'; but it requires a mind open to realizing that every failure still holds a truth, & to searching for what the real lesson was. That's what makes science such a worthy pursuit. And such a great precursor to real life!  jh (this from someone trying desperately to convince herself that she needs to take trigonometry as an adult learner.....uughhh!)

It is human nature to want to find the reason or connection when you receive a diagnosis of cancer.  Unfortunately I have had many close to me face this disease and lose the battle.  My first gsd Reno was diagnosed with a sinus tumor and throughout the ordeal I just wanted to know why.  I guess in one way we want to know it is not something we did (food, environment, vaccines), etc because the thought of being responsibile for putting them thru this is unbearable.  

On the other hand if it can be linked to genetics, then you feel some what empowered that if you stop breeding those lines you can help reduce cancer in the breed.

So if it gives comfort to someone for someone who has lost their dog to lymphoma and or who is facing that now to gather data and compare similarities, etc, then I am all for it.  Everyone faces this battle and greives differently. 

Cheryl

For sure I will never again buy a GSD with certain dogs in the pedigree. There is one dog that has appeared in the pedigree of my own dog and 4 others I know of that  have or had leukemia. Coincidence? Maybe, but I'm not willing to put it to the test.  I'll just stay away from that dog who is, BTW, 100% Am lines, no imported dogs anywhere.  Also, I will never again vaccinate another dog annually for rabies or bombard another dog's immune system with every vaccination known to man  unless it is something life threatening.  IMO nusance diseases like kennel cough do not warrant vaccinations for healthy adult dogs. Others can do as they please.

I sure don't expect to set the canine world on fire by trying to learn what I can about these diseases and don't look at myself as any type of researcher. However, I do feel it's not a waste of time to use other's experience to try to find out if there is a common link or links such as over vaccinating, genetics, allergies, environment. How can that be anything but valuable information for GSD owners and breeders?  What's the harm? All the bloody secrecy in this breed has already caused many problems.  It's at the point that if your dog clears it's hip and elbow xrays,  doesn't have EPI and doesn't try to eat the neighbor's kid, you are told you are lucky. We have been taught to settle for so little in this breed when it comes to health issues. 

Renofan's post has opened another question for me - could tracking in an area that has been treated with pesticides or herbicides be a cause of cancer? How many  SAR dogs at Ground Zero developed a form of cancer?  I think K9SAR who posts here said her GSD worked there and later died due to a form of cancer. I know of one Czech GSD owned by a NYC police officer that worked at Ground Zero and died from lymphosarcoma a few years later. She told me that many of the SAR dogs that worked there got sick; some with cancer, others with lung disease. How about treating your lawn with chemicals? 

My first dogs lived very long, healthy lifes. The average was 12 1/2 years, the oldest 14 1/2. No vet bills for most, they were never sick. Not GSD's BTW, another large working breed. Had one older female with a benign breast tumor that was not lifethreatening, that was it. For the most part they were kennel dogs, never exposed to any chemicals other than the diluted bleach I used to disenfect their kennels and their flea preventative. Removed them when I disenfected, put them back after the solution dried. All but one kennel was pea gravel. They ate a cheap local food, corn as the protein source. Annual distemper/parvo vacs until they reached 7 years, nothing after that. Rabies every 3 year until age 8 no older unless I knew the dog law officer was coming to inspect.  No lyme or kennel cough vaccines. I also boarded, and still never had a dog with kennel cough. Was it genes, environment, the corn based diet? I'll never know. The one thing I do know is that, according to what I read here and on other GSD breed boards,  GSD's are not a very healthy breed compared to many large working breeds and hearing that one lives to be 12 years old  without wracking up a pile of vet bills is a rarity. 

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