Showing German at an Ameraican Show - Page 7

Thanks mirasmom

Mystere, I agree very sad!!

The crippled American dogs can NOT jump their own Height, so getting past Novice Class would be very hard.
Maybe the American Shepherd can get added to the SPECIAL LIST and only jump 3/4 of the dogs height, like the Dachshunds.
 

Just taking a wild guess here, but maybe GretchAnya is Smith's screen name?

'She said, and I quote - ".......I think they are ugly"'

Well, I'd agree with Ms Fisher.

I'm sure she's referring to the roach-backs.  (Roach-backs are too, VERY prevalent from what I see, contrary to some claiming they're gone - pishtosh.)  Possibly also the huge bear-heads that tend to hang low rather than a decent natural dog-carriage.

Of course, I think "American" dogs are ugly; too narrow (like Irish Setters), weak stops/heads, large but weak ears (often), over-long pasterns everywhere which flop about and appear Paso-Fino-like just when walking.

The truth is both American-show and German-show leave alot to be desired, conformation-wise.

Also, the truth is some German and some "half-breeds" (if you will) ARE getting into the AKC ring and some are chipping away at the status quo.

I agree with the person who said about Labs - how can you make a difference if you don't fight directly and go to the shows?  I know this is true of Labs, as well as GS.  You just give up and wash your hands of them, and say "I'll never support that" - but you're NOT fighting it!  And so they have won and gotten a niche in the bloodlines, so major some say it should be a different breed.

BTW, for all those "different breed" comments - why?  There was no effort to do so, per se, and no cross-breeding to dogs who were absolutely a different breed or mutts to obtain this style; it was built into the breed, just bad choices.  They are NOT a different breed, and from what I've seen can be outcrossed successfully.  (Of course, neither is the "white GS", but that didn't stop angry people from separating.)

I'll still say the greatest dog I ever knew of, bar none, was the 1 I was privileged to own years ago, who was shall we say, a "total outcross".  But she looked like a Shepherd SHOULD look (being not ANY of the fashionable , and had temperament to die for - not unstable at all, and didn't need "conditioning" to "learn" to be stable, as I see too many times even here.

Since you asked about American Champions, this is a dog I like (he was the #2 dog in AKC behind Dallas for a couple of years).  Ch Andaka-Zederland's U R It   www.members.aol.com/andaka/tagfile.htm

He's got preformance titles as did his sire and I know the owners are currently working him in Agility, Obedience and tracking.

Melissa

Forget AKC shows.  If your dog isn't an ugly ASS that looks like a giraffe he won't place.  Look at the last Westminster GSD entry.  Sad and disgusting - AKC shows are a lost cause, don't waste your time.

byceltic, nice that the dog is smart and has good temperament and has attained degrees.  However he is way off the SV/FCI standard and built like almost all American Shepherds (AS).  See my comment above as to why and get your tracing paper out.  The dog you refer to is a long, long dog with a long, long back.  Not a real GS in my view.  So far from what a real West German import blooded GSD that it is "in your face" obvious.

celtic/Melissa - he's not perfect but he IS better than many from what I can tell.  More typical "all-breed" dog - the BETTER American dogs (which many here don't realize are different types, themselves), despite not "focusing" on GS with "real GS people who concentrate on GS".  We see where that's gotten us.  All-breed people tend to see the forest for the trees better, which I dare say many in the breed including in Germany do not.

Conformation-wise I do GENERALLY like the "working-line" dogs better than any others, but I see plenty of regular dogs out there whom all GS-sport-obsessed people would frown upon who seem much more proper intended breed type than the high-bred high-cost dogs in the hobbies supposedly "to standard" (which many are not, in truth).  The AKC standard BTW, really is not that different from others.  I can't see it.  The problem is what (popular, powerful) people decide it says vs. what it really says.  I believe that trust has been broken on both sides of the pond.  The dogs are not the same as they were 50 years ago, and I do not believe what we have "in style" is an improvement on that at all.  The working lines do fit it better.  But generally, the show lines all do not hold a candle to the *natural* dog of 50 years ago, IMHO.

Since the americans who breed for AKC shows think they do it so much better than the germans, why not rename the american line dog American Show Shepherd and be done with it?  They look nothing like true GSDs, the dog at  the end of the line in an SV show is so much better than anything we saw at Westminster.

FCI/SV standard for the GSD.  Take a typical photo of Ursus Batu and you'll see a GSD that is perfect to the standard.  I am referring to the current FCI standard as approved by the SV, not ones older.  But you can take the photo Oli uses on his header is you like or if you want I will list many GSD of West German breeding that are very close to this standard.  Anyone who examines all the top American AKC/GSDCA specialty show photos and compares them to the top SV show photos will immediately understand the generic differences in structure.  If they can't then their perceptual skills are comprimised.  In that case using tissue paper tracings to compare one to another and to the standrad is often helpful.

Preston, long body or short legs? How to tell the difference................