Czech GSD's with bad hips - Page 9

"I do OFA only  because people ask for it as a courtesy. I personally do not need it because I can read x rays. I have learned from the best.  It may shock you that I will not do OFA on Adela because I do not want to. They are fine and I will not waste money on this.  If you need to know what they are look at the pictures. If you do not  know how to read it ask someone who does.
Hans"

I hope that people reading this thread pay close attention to the above quote.
(Hans, you could have just wrote, "I'm smarter than everbody. If you're unsure, just ask me.")
This is the exact mentality that has ruined the GSD in this country for many, many years.
And, this is from a person that some of you consider to be a cornerstone of the GSD breed.


Slamdunc,
Very well said:
"Because a breeder may be able to read an X ray doesn't necessarily help the rest of us who rely on hip scores or ratings, especially when looking at pedigrees.  If only a certain breeder "knows" how  the hips are, how does that help us years from now when researching dogs?  If I can't find the X-rays 5 or 10 years from now to read myself I am out of luck.....But OFA or the SV would have the results if the dog was actually certified."

Hi OGBS, slamdunk, hexe....and the many readers out there...

Thank you for seeing the bigger picture...

I mean Hans, talking of 30 years + breeding and doesn't want to do OFA Hips because it's a waste of his money...
Hans, you shot yourself in the foot here...

Jenni78,

You simply cannot stick to the topic but are always worried about spelling mistakes, and judging peoples credibility, etc.
Please note that a person that cannot spell is by no means a stupid OR uneducated person...
By you paying attention to minor things like a .... shows your mentality and perhaps your IQ level
AND YOU HAVE OVER 5000 POSTS, WHAT HAVE YOU LEARNED ALL ALONG....

There is a huge diffence between a - normal and a - noch zugelassen...
All German pedigrees state hips a - normal OR a - fast normal OR a - noch zugelassen...
They dont just say "a" and expect the owners/ readers to SMELL  what they mean...

OFA  also clearly defines the A hips as A - Excellent OR A- Good OR A - Fair OR A1,A2,A3....

So quit defending people when they are wrong, they not gonna give you a free puppy...
and I asked Hans to answer, he hasn't nominated you, has he....

.....................................................................................................................................................................................................................

BTW; I got a PM earlier from a fellow Forum user like myself which Hans will pay special attention to;
allanf was so right when cautioning us on Urf z Jirkova Dvora as noch zugelassen and my brief observations on Furo Kamos CS progeny and grand - progeny...

The msg is relating to an Urf z Jirkova Dvora puppy who has been screened and the hips, both hips are severe...not mild OR moderate...
The person is just waiting for the pup to turn a year old and will then do the Official x-rays..

Just noticed that Hans has changed the Hip grading of Urf z Jirkova Dvora to A3 on his website....
Thanx Hans, better late than never...
You should actually be thanking me, but don't worry, i'm fine...

Jenni78 - what do you have to say about Hans changing it to A3 instead of A which you were defending with your life...
vonnisk- any comments from your side on this issue...
aaykay- you are way too quiet...

Ghostly - how you doing, you wanted a name and Urf z Jirkova Dvora is on the previous post, named...
Looks like more is gonna come from this... 30 years + breeding and they don't know of problem studs who they've used over and over...

I think they do know and that's why Hans is propagating not doing OFA because they are concerned that all puppy buyers will go and OFA grade their dogs and this will lead to massive negative exposure....

Do we need this in the already problematic GSD World...

Are you just plain nuts or can you truly not understand what I wrote? 

 You just want to keep going on and on and on. I'm going to work. 

Why would anyone but a rank novice buy a GSD puppy from parents without CERTIFIED normal hips and elbows as the minimum?

Jenni: Are you just plain nuts or can you truly not understand what I wrote? 

 You just want to keep going on and on and on. I'm going to work.

I think after shooting her mouth off and laying out her "depth"- yet another time - on the net, for the world to see, with no recourse to go back and edit it after you educated her on it, she is now back with more yakking, without admitting to her original faux paus....and/or thanking you for educating a rank newbie like her.

I will say this.
1. If you think that OFA and non OFA x -ray cost differs by  $30 difference, then you do not know what you are talking about .
If I go to my vet and do regular xray  then it costs me $90. If I do OFA type x rays with paperwork then it costs me $390 + mail + OFA fee.  That is $300+ difference. 
But that is not an issue. I can afford the OFA x rays. 
The main reason why I do not care to do OFA is that 
2.I have seen misread x rays by OFA so many times that I do not  care about wasting money on it. BUT!!!!! As I have said I do  OFA   because people want it but to me there is no benefit.   Some time ago my friend  ( and I witnessed it)  send 3 xrays of the same dog to OFA and got evaluation of  OFA good, OFA  fair and OFA moderate dysplasia. On the same dog x rayed at the same time(!!!).  I have  seen different evaluations on same dog done by different registries too. 
3. I post the xrays on my website and on  the PDB which I believe is more then honest and more valuable then to do OFA and blindly rely on it..
4.  As far as me being smarter on  the issue then others ( as some one  mentioned in a snarky way)  I would say that i am in continuous learning process.  I also firmly believe that if you do not know how to read hips and if you want to breed then you need to learn. It is not that difficult.
 I am helping people all the time to understand hips on my website, here and elsewhere and in private. To rely on OFA in my book is foolish. Even in the best case scenario the OFA will read what they see. And if the dog was not positioned properly , which happens more often then not,  then they will downgrade them. Then if you consider such faulty evaluation then you  may be  eliminating temperament wise  an excellent   dog from breeding program because the vet took crappy  xray and you or whom ever  could not tell the difference. 
That i s than narrowing genetic pool and destroys proper selection and ultimately damages the breed., That is why the breeder should know how to read the x rays and how the proper x ray should look like. That is all I am saying.
And if that is " shooting myself into the foot' then so be it. 
Hans

Aadilah07 said:
Just noticed that Hans has changed the Hip grading of Urf z Jirkova Dvora to A3 on his website....
Thanx Hans, better late than never...
You should actually be thanking me, but don't worry, i'm fine...


You have just noticed what had been there all the time.

Aadilah07 said:
I think they do know and that's why Hans is propagating not doing OFA because they are concerned that all puppy buyers will go and OFA grade their dogs and this will lead to massive negative exposure....

 I do not "propagate"(?) ( do you mean promote?)  OFA one way or the other. OFA is just a tool. You can use it or you can use different tool. You can use it well and you can not use it well.  I am just saying that to trust to OFA or any other hips reading outfit  without more insight is foolish. I am saying that breeders  should learn to read the x rays if you want to breed. I firmly encourage all my customer to x ray their dogs and OFA them  if they do.... and most do. Then they send me the results and that helps me to breed quality hips as I do and improve on quality of my dog's   hips.  I personally do not need OFA for that though.