Breed Improvement Suggestions for the UK GSD Breed Council - Page 8

Read all the above and learn thereby lies the problem. Fact - the only constant in the scheme of things is that some things will never change.  Ce' la vie.

AS

Bancroft

You refer to international sch careers i would like to contribute to that but need it defined ie Kennel name sire dam and career etc my definition of a international carreer would be a dog that had made international selection and the parentage going back to grandparents, will be interested in your thoughts PM if you do not want to go public

S

What a crying shame, and how easily we are put off of our good intentions... I guess that is the intention of some, it's certainly what some predicted right from the start of our postings.  I shall carry on with my letter to the BC & the KC tho' with no agreement on content it shall inevitably carry less weight.

Bancroft, I think we could have worked together, I'm less sure about "reason" (interesting choice of name) & Gustav but I'd have made every effort and allowance as I believe you would have done.

It's not bad to debate except when it defeats a purpose that could benefit all, especially the dogs themselves!

A Shepherd, I loathe your type... but it looks like you were right!

I have put together a letter to the Breed Council and a separate one to the KC re improving screening for the GSD breed.

I have put forward the suggestions put above, which include bringing the Breed Survey requirements up to date, which would involve reducing the hip score for the Breed Survey, adding in the Elbow scoring, the limitation of linebreeding to 3:3, haemophila testing for males.  I have also included suggestion that UK dogs are screened in the UK, after all it was Malcolm Willis who stated that the A fast normal accepted in Germany was probably much higher than we would accept in the UK for breeding from).

I have also suggested that some kind of test such as the GCDS should be undertaken by dogs even if they hold working papers as a dog should show itself as well tempered in the company of others, and easily controlled and well mannered.  The GCDS also requires some knowledge by the owner too!

I have also put in the letter to the Breed council that the survey should be adjusted to allow for longcoats, East, West and English allowing for interpretation of the breed standard to ensure that they all get screened under their own type so that the breed as a whole can improve without bias from the other sides.  I have also asked for the wording on "appropriate accommodation for the bitch to whelp and raise puppies" to be reconsidered as it is such a vague statement.  Surely that could be a person with minimal facilities but loads of time or equally the most expensive whelping bed, kennel and ignored for 23 hrs a day!

I want the breed to move forward and not backwards, until the sniping and moaning stops and people work for the breed things will not improve and probably deteriorate.

Missbeeb, I have owned the "German Shepherd in Word and Picture" since 1971. Where in this book does it say that the German Shepherd should be beautiful???? I'll tell what the good Capt. does say; "The Beauty of the dog lies in its utility". This clearly demonstates what the originator of the breed had as his priorites. Also, where did I allude a dog shouldn't conform to the standard??????? Many working dogs have good conformation, and I always strive for good conformation in my dogs but it cannot be at the expense of working ability. It is the misperception of "Beauty" being an esoteric thing that leads to problems. Also, the majority of working dogs settle down quite well, ask any police officer that owns a GS and takes his dog home. The majority of the Czech dogs today have good conformation, will work well, and settle down quite well. I have not said anything detrimental to show dogs, what I have said, is a priority and commitment to utility/working is the only way to keep the breed the way "it was made to be". Where is the defensive show/working BS coming from....I don't care what kind of GS you are talking about...if is works well it is a good breed specimen(showlines or working lines), if it doesn't work then it is not a good specimen....period! Too much defensiveness often reveals insecurities!!!!!! If your show lines will work then you are not one to heed the words of the Capt., but their are too many breeders today that are not breeding utlility dogs and that is inexcusable regardless of type!!  So if you are striving to improve the breed if the priorities are skewed the results will be skewed and "Excuses will abound", pure and simple!.

HMMMMMMMMMMM

i would suggest that the B and Tan is Nikonis and the black bitch Latchetts Tequila but if you go back a little further there are others

Gustav, I think I'm right in saying that you thought that BH was a good start yes?  Yet you failed to offer ANY support after your initial comment!  Look back at my postings, you will see that I clearly mention that European working dogs generally conform to the standard!!  Some of ours do and some do not.

It's sooooooo dreary having to repeat oneself again & again; I know rather a lot of police who have shepherds... all but two are "show" lines, none have any real problems.

The point is, we hoped (bless us) to do a wee bit to improve on our present situation - breed, work & health... silly fools eh?

Missbeeb - snap on the police dog issue. 

Let us fools continue with our efforts and hope that evenutally others will see the light the way we have.

Missbeeb, If the police dogs are showdogs then they show utility and I applaud them!! Again, you people brought up the show / working issue. I just bring up commitment to utility criteria to improve breeding practices and the fact that the initial posts about improving the breed seemed to lack this element. That was the content of my original post, nothing more nothing less. Seemed the right thing, to chime in with Bancroft about the lack of working language that was being considered during a period of GS history that many breeders are breeding non working GS. Was not pointing at show people BUT if they are not generally producing this, I can understand the touchiness. I hope you get your mission accomplished in terms of "breed suggestions for your breed council", Good Luck and if they work, Gustav is with you!!