Puppy Prices - Page 6

Ok, fair enough.

Then, look for progeny of this dog for French Ring: http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/466304.html

The website of the owner and trainer is: http://guerrierducrepuscule.free.fr/

The name of the dog owner is Jean Michael Lartaud

There is a thread that I recently started, that shows this dog in action in a video, the thread is are gsds capable of Fr, or something to that effect.

Hope that helps.

GSDs doing French Ring arereally rare and far and between, it really is a Malinois turf.

MVF:  Please continue 

Why is it that in europe the puppy prices are very reasonable and very affordable minus the shipping? If you lived in europe you'd have a puppy for like 400-500EU and that is a good quality puppy.

You also can get very reasonable prices for young adults that show promise and if we want to talk about titled dogs you know you can get them also for a fair price. They might be the most expensive once but you still can strike a deal with the breeder or he'll lower it.

If you know how to talk business especially with them countries that have low unemployment rate like Slovakia, Bosnia, Serbia, Hungary, Romania you will probably get a good titled dog for a reasonable price.

I just do not understand how a lot of people fall for few breeders here in the united states. They jack up the prices so high up because the dog is a import and is from another country and has a title or few.  I admit I'm from europe but I am not being biased because I talked to a lot of breeders from eastern europe [That is where I am from] and it is pretty easy to lower the price and strike a price that is very acceptable and reasonable!

When I see prices like 2,000-4,000USD here I just click out their web-site or tell them no in an E-mail. And that is for puppies I can imagine what they sell their adult dogs for. I see some one sell one of their adult dogs for like 15,000USD, that is insane unless you're loaded and can afford to blow money on whatever you want.

MVF - very interesting model.  If you have time to post it, I'd be interested in reading the rest.  

Looks like my dog was a steal!   

I charge people 800 bucks.
I require penhipp before the age of 6 mos.. I have seen dogs being destroyed because of bad food and letting them jump too early.
If it is genetic it will show early and I can replace the pup..
I also require the dogs to be titled before they are bred.
There is nothing wrong with my bloodlines.. they can be found in any 2000 dollar puppy. I hate overpricing pupies because I think they should be available to people who want to work them, not just to people who can affort them.
Prices of some pups are pretty comical.. 3500 for a puppy??? hell NO..

If we need to state statistices then here is the breakdown of the Pups to be in the dogsi mentioned above
Father of Pups
Sch3 IPO 3, KKL" for life DNA
His Parents Sire Sch2    Dam Sch1 next generation 3 Sch3 Dogs, one Sch1 dog Next generation 8 Sch3 Dogs Next Generation 13 Sch 3 Dogs, one Sch2 Dog one Sch1 Dog

Mother of Pups Her first litter just over 2 years old  BH, AD DNA
Her sire Sch3 His Parents Both Sch3  Next Generation 3 Sch3 Dogs, one Sch 1 dog, Next Gerneration 7 Sch 3 dogs one Sch1 dog
Her Mother Sch1 dog, Her Parents Both Sch 3 Dogs next generation 3 Sch3 dogs one Sch1 Dog next generation
7 Sch3 dogs one Sch1 Dog
You can hardly get better than in the working line and all for $900 At a quick count around 50 Sch3 Dogs in pedigree
Steve

Interesting MVF. Makes sense. I used to charge more for my best working line pups ($1800-2200 in the 90's) and had no problem getting it in northern CA, but since I moved to the sticks in PA I lowered my prices, partly because its a pretty good jaunt out here to my place, partly because there are not as many working handlers who want top prospects here as there (less demand) and partly because I am more interested in "normal", non-wealthy people being able to have a nice dog to work than making a killing on a litter these days. Also, this place is way less than impressive. I suspect when some people pull into my rutted, steep driveway and step into my tiny, sparsely decorated house, they fully expect to get a puppy cheaper here than someplace else. Its amazing how much white fences, fancy light posts, wrought iron gates, nice landscaping and an impressive house/kennel adds to the price of a dog! People forget that the only thing they get to take home when they leave is the expensive dog. I prefer to invest my money in the dogs, which is why this place doesn't look any better.

Some of the reasons dogs and pups are cheaper in Germany-

• There are 2,000+ SV clubs, and membership dues are low, helper work free. Nobody has to drive a long way or pay a lot of money to train/title/show dogs. It doesn't take so long because most people train at at least one other club than their home club, can train every day/night of the week with great helpers, within 8-10 miles of their home. A gal of gas will get you anyplace in your LG. Zero to SchH3 +Korung in 3-5 months is normal when you have those kinds of resources available!
• Entry fees are low, as no one has to fly in a judge, put him up in a hotel for a week, entertain him, etc. They come, judge the event, and go home. Cost- about 50 euros (judge's fee) + gas + lunch and a few beers. 
• No need to take off work, drive a couple hundred miles, stay in a hotel and eat out for a trial/show/Korung. There are quite a few in every LG every weekend.
• Stud fees are about half or less over there than they are here, and there are plenty of great dogs to choose from right in one's immediate region.
• Dogfood is high, but chances are the breeder didn't pay anything for the dog they are breeding as a puppy, likely free from another club member.
• Vet fees are generally lower IMExp and they don't try to rake you over the coals for things your dog doesn't need. It doesn't cost $500.-600 to get h & e certs!
• Puppies are NOT guaranteed. No need to keep a slush fund in the bank for refunds if a whole litter turns out to be loaded with disqualifying faults.

It all goes back to how many and how large the clubs in one's region. The more working enthusiasts, the higher the demand. The NW Region has a LOT of large clubs. Not so in the Northeast and much of the rest of this country.
I honestly don't know how some folks get so much more than I charge for a good working prospect for dogs without half the credentials mine have. I suspect the white fences have a lot to do with it.

I can only imagine what this place would look like if I had put the $30K I spent on dogs last year into it.
SS

SS

Shelley,
  I can agree on the white fence thing. also breeders that are salesmen ! that's where alot of people can make alot more, is their ability to bullsh$t the buyers by telling them what they want to hear. being in the military i get to see and hear alot from guys around the base. how they bought this great dog for whatever amount, this dog can do anything, and they think its funny and normal for said shepherd to bark and growl at anyone that pass's by! had a guy at my unit ask if i'd breed my male to his female, my reply is what are her bloodlines and does she have any titles. when he looked at me like a deer in the headlights and replied well i paid 300$ for her and she is AKC reg. i kindly explained to him that i will not stud my male to a female just for the purpose of producing puppies, there are plenty of ppl already doing so with no goal in mind just like the ppl he bought his bitch from!
 people know what they want to HEAR, and think they know what they want ! it's like going shopping while your hungry, eveything looks good and dam$it i'm going to buy it! well most regular people are impulse buyers, so do your dogs look and sound good to what they think they want? doubt it, most people don't care that you know the bloodlines and what they have produced for generations, they want what is great RIGHT NOW ! regardless of what that is producing. alot of people want a puppy and have no idea the work and patience it takes to make them like mom or dad ! little lone the ability and god given gift to train a truly TOP DOG.  anyways don't want to keep rambling. SS your not losing money, your doing what the powers that be intended you to do, train, breed, and love and enjoy your dogs, and hopefully make back a small fraction of the cost to keep your head above water !

good day all,
 kenny
  

Yup, I agree with the 'baffle them with bullsh!t'  thing. I think that is what does it. Telling them what they want to hear, not necessarily the truth.

    When I was looking for a LH I found a breeder that bred GSL xGWL from titled grandparents, asking $1000 for stockhair, and $1500 for a LH. Now she's switched strictly to selling LH, and is no longer bothering with the stockcoat. Not as much money in it.
 
   My breeder, on the other hand, breeds WL stockcoats, happened to get a LC and sold it $400 dollars cheaper because it was not to standard. That is the sign of a good breeder.

1200-1500 for working pup