E Collars on 3.5 mo. old puppies??? - Page 6

Christopher, I am the last person you will meet who is anti-compulsion in puppies. Like you, I feel it is more fair to introduce it early, I feel it also greatly strengthens the dogs' ability to handle pressure. But not this early, and the key here is FAIRNESS. E-collars are tricky things, a great tool in the right hands, abusive in the wrong ones. I do not feel an ecollar on a pup this young is fair and you will not convince me otherwise.

Reminds me of the time I say a lady in Petstoopid with a 9 week old lab pup- with a small gauge prong collar on it. I asked her why the pup had it on, she replied, "because our trainer told us to". Pup didn't even know how to walk on a leash yet, and it has a collar on that applies a very strong correction. I told her as politely as I could that was way too young for that collar and walked away.

To the OP: how is the pup? I hope they are seeking a new trainer, not only does their pup still need training, but now there is clearly damage that needs to be undone.

The problem is not the e-collar but the trainer or handler...I see this phobia about e- coolars because of inappropriate use of them by others in the past...15 years ago this same phobia was with prong collars....Helll if you go to an AKC show you will still find phobia's against prong collars.....I don't have an opinion on the OP situation because I don't know the dog, person, or trainer. I will say this...I agree in principle with what Christopher Smith says and don't see anything irresponsible about his approach. One of the biggest problems in training dogs are behavoirs that should have been addressed early and now the level of intervention(compulsion or positive), produces conflict, or is so time consuming as to be counterproductive. Again, not condoning use of e-collar in this case as I don't know the particulars, but for all I know the dog could be extemely shy and freezes up becuase of temperament.....Lastly, I would be lying if I said that I haven't seen e-coolars used at minimal frequencies successfullly with young dogs as it marks correct behavoir with no adverse impact. I have also seen people use it inappropriately, but I have never seen the e-collar operate itself.JMO

I agree some compulsion is OK for puppies. I'm pretty damn heavy handed on mine and it hasn't seemed to hurt any of them but I just don't see a need for an E at that age. If the pup is chasing cars, the handler needs to get off his/her ass and get a leash on that pup. If the pup is biting or aggressive...doesn't sound like it if he's freezing up but I would say the E would cause more problems than fix. I would feel rediculous trying to get my collar strapped around a pups tiny neck and can't think of a single reason or problem I have ever had or seen in a pup to warrant it. With a pup on a leash or long line, you have all the control you need at that age. Weenies usually work at that age and if not, I don't worry about the OB.

Christopher, you can wage this war all ya want but the pup is freezing up so something isn't right for this puppy.

i do not care who you are you could be the biggest and badest trainer in the world.if you have to  use an e collar on a pyppy then you are an idiot,dumbass and a fucking brain less moron.there are no reasons and no behaviour problems where you need an e collar.and if you need an e collar for a puppy then you should give up dogs and get a fish or something.have a nice one.

Christopher, you can wage this war all ya want but the pup is freezing up so something isn't right for this puppy.


I have not given an opinion on that situation.

who cares if a 12 WEEK old puppy shows interest in "chasing cars" ??  At that age, they are only looking at movement - prey drive - shouldn't be off-leash around traffic anyway, so - walk the other way!  redirect on a toy!  Or, just ignore the behavior - who cares? 

Who cares is my client that has a 5 month old Dalmatian that will go ballistic and attack any car it sees. Even those that are parked so it’s not just prey drive. He could give a shit about food when he gets in this state. In fact if you get close enough to give him the food he will redirect and try to bite you. Now the dog is under socialized, because the family is scared to walk off their property, and is starting to act weird around other things. Otherwise this is a normal puppy.

And you idea about walking the other way and ignore it is trite. Some people live in these places called “cities”. And there are cars in all directions. There are also people trying to walk on the sidewalks that would prefer to not interact with 40lbs of spotted fury.

 Christopher writes: "Now the dog is under socialized, because the family is scared to walk off their property, and is starting to act weird around other things. Otherwise this is a normal puppy." 

I submit to you Christopher that the pup is NOT acting normal.  Worse yet, neither are his human care takers in letting him get to this point. Somewhere along the line serious mistakes have been made and if what you write is true, yes, the dog is in real trouble and if it does not end up getting hit and killed by a car, it will bite someone and end up being put down. Sounds like you also need to get some help, or suggest that the owners of this dog get some serious help with a competent trainer. You seem to have some serious misconceptions about training.

  

Thanks for the suggestion, but I am well on my way to fixing the dog.

And what are my misconceptions?

Who cares is my client that has a 5 month old Dalmatian that will go ballistic and attack any car it sees. Even those that are parked so it’s not just prey drive. He could give a shit about food when he gets in this state. In fact if you get close enough to give him the food he will redirect and try to bite you. Now the dog is under socialized, because the family is scared to walk off their property, and is starting to act weird around other things. Otherwise this is a normal puppy.
And you idea about walking the other way and ignore it is trite. Some people live in these places called “cities”. And there are cars in all directions. There are also people trying to walk on the sidewalks that would prefer to not interact with 40lbs of spotted fury. Quote by Christopher


 I think you said it all when you said it was a Dalmation.   I had an aunt who had a whole series of  Dalmations and every single one of them was psycho.  Each one had "quirks" similar to what you have described, and each would bite/attack a person in a heartbeat by redirecting an attack on an inanimate object, another person, another dog, or for no diescernable reason at all.    The only good thing I can say is that she lucked out and never had a deaf one. Psycho-loonies, every one of them.  SERIOUS temperament issues...and I didn't even know that word at the time!   One of my biggest disappointments in adult life was a call from her that she'd found a photo of me and my dog...and  what she sent me was not a photo of me and my first gsd--it was me and one of her damn, nutcase Dals!    I guess it was appropriate:  I was the only family-member that none of her Dals ever bit or tried to bite.