Breed Improvement Suggestions for the UK GSD Breed Council - Page 43

Reason, Bancroft forget it. There is no so blind as those who cannot see. They will not accept that the mental health of the GSD is equally as important as the physical.  They make all kinds of sweeping statements about sch. Clubs wont train them, it makes the dogs handler aggresive.  Do they have first hand knowledge of this. If a dog bites who isn't doing sch what on earth triggered that? What makes Peggy think that a improving the mental health of the GSD would make it unsound for pet ownership!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The bottom line is they don't want to do it. Nobody said they had to. Isn't that what the two tier system was all about, those who wanted to could and those who didn't wouldn't be excluded? So what are they so afraid of? We all should want a GSD that is sound in body and mind, I know I do. I must have been fortunate because of all the dogs I have had over the last 25/30 years I've had only two poor hip scores, yet those hips did not spoil their quality of life. I have had one with DM and that was heart breaking.  I thought this thread was about improving the GSD, and before any one jumps down my throat, yes, the physical health is important. How many more times must this be said. But why are you all so afraid of putting the mental health of the breed you say you love along side that. Why don't you care about that?

So Reason, Bancroft if like me you are both selecting your dogs from the working lines then you will be OK.  It's sad, I know, to seem to be turning your back on the breed but what else can you do?

Jess

Bancroft, good posts!

Health issues: we've done our bit (for the moment) with the proposal, I'm sure we all know that it's far from perfect but it's a very good start, if we can get it accepted.  We could have done with more positive input from more people and we could certainly have done with more help in its' distribution!

Working/Temperament issues: this is what we are supposed to be looking at now!  Reason is in the process of writing a workable proposal for us to present to the BC.

Bancroft, I've just watched the video!   He was clearly having "the best time".  I believe that most dogs will work, given the chance and all dogs benefit from having "something" to do!

It seems like trying to push jelly up a very steep hill with little support,we have addressed the health issues, and if people think that other healty tsests are required they should lobby the Breed CLUBS and Breed Council for there inclusion in the criteriafor survey

What we are trying to acheive here is a format were the Breed Clubs via the BC formulate a survey system, with all consideration to health physical and mental, and then take that to the KC for application into a two teir registration system

We are not trying to stop pet breeders or indeed circle running dog breeders, we are attempting to promote the GSD as a Utility working dog and a joy to own,using a carefully thought out survey system such as the one availble on the continent

Approx 400,000 gain sch quailification each year are all their owners wrong and we the breeders in the UK right?

As for sch clubs refusing to train certain types of dogs, i am sure there are people from both training organisations watching this board and would immediately report to their respective chairmans that the club was not actively promoting the sport, we in the sport spend many hours promoting the sport and helping the less experienced.

Regarding handler aggression i am not sure you are quailified to assess or assume that, if shown it is generally a frustrated animal try to make something happen or the dog not understanding his pack position

Mr Milan doesnt have any handler aggression issues RULES,BOUNDARIES,LIMITATIONS.

Reason, if I've understood Sheila Rankin properly... it's only the BC we have to convince re: working/temperament tests.  The KC have already agreed to the BC Survey being mandatory... before an "enhanced" pedigree is acquired.  So, the BC can include whatever's considered necessary in their Survey.  This should make the process easier, providing the GSD Clubs are for it of course.

Question

Doee anyone now the criteria for entry to a Breed Council (UK )Breed Survey, i have been on their web site but it seems its a bit of a secret

Reason, all I have ever found is the Guide lines which are listed on the Download page.  This is what is given:

GUIDE TO ENTRANTS OF THE GSD BREED COUNCIL’S ADULT BREED SURVEY

1. Complete and sign entry form before returning it by the appropriate date to the Host Club. Ensure that the fee is

enclosed, as no classification will be issued unless fees are paid in full. If a copy of the Survey is required a S.A.E

must also be included. Only dogs of eighteen months and over on date of Survey may be entered for classification.

2. ON THE DAY REQUIREMENTS

(a) Dog as defined on the entry form (b) Pedigree of the dog (c) KC Registration certificate and Tattoo or micro-chip

certificate (d) BVA hip status certificate and/or proof of foreign hip status (e) Proof of Idexx Haemophilia test

(applicable to males only) (f) Evidence of Working Qualifications (if applicable) must be provided

IN THE EVENT OF ANY OF THESE DOCUMENTS BEING UNAVAILABLE ON THE DAY THE SURVEYOR WILL

NOTE THIS ON THE SURVEY FORM. THE SURVEY CERTIFICATE WILL NOT BE ISSUED UNTIL COPIES OF

MISSING DOCUMENTS ARE LODGED WITH BREED COUNCIL SECRETARY.

3. In the case of missing teeth due to accident it is the responsibility of the owner to provide veterinary evidence.

4. ON THE DAY PROCEDURE

(a) Report to the administration area and present all relevant documents

(b) Collect Survey sheets and report to measuring area

(c) Report to main area for Survey

(d) Be available when required for gun-test etc. Owners will be required to handle their own dogs during the gun test and

character test.

5. RESULTS

Recommended Classifications will be announced by the end of the event when the Surveyor will be available to

comment.

6. CLASSIFICATION GUIDE LINES



CLASS ONE

a. DENTITION: Must have a full and correct mouth.

b. HIP STATUS: Up to and including a total score of 20 (males & females) with not more than 12 on one hip.

c. SIZE: To allow 3.5 cms above the ideal height i.e up to 66 cms (males) & 61 cms (females)



CLASS ONE (minus)

Males which are over 66cms but below 68cms and females that are 61cms but below 63cms

but are otherwise excellent animals may be given CLASS ONE (minus). Ensure that this is

clearly noted on the Survey Form.



CLASS TWO

a. DENTITION: Allow up to two P1 missing OR one incisor missing OR one P2 missing OR one double P1.

Outside of this range will mean an automatic fail.

b. HIP STATUS: Up to and including a total score of 20 (males & females) with not more than 12 on one hip.

c. SIZE: Males up to 68cms. Females up to 63cms.



CLASS TWO (minus)

by tigermouse on 13 September 2008 - 23:09

I have a problem... The gun test, my dogs are trained to protect me as i used work them in the security sector, would this be an issue in a breed survey?

They are trained to do a stand off on sight of a gun and then attack on command.