Breed Improvement Suggestions for the UK GSD Breed Council - Page 41

Liz, if you taken an honest look, you'll see that Peggy has never been anything but negative.  Yes, I am very forthright but I seldom intend to offend.  "Slammed" is a little too dramatic for my taste, however, if that is how you really feel, no doubt you'll feel obliged to mention Peggy's negativity and her out of order comments to Sue B at some point on here?

I have little time for those (like Peggy) that just sit back and "poke holes" whilst making no effort themselves.  The Shepherd is our breed and I believe we should all make an effort.

MISSBEEB,i have looked back over all the posts,and Peggy posted at the start and you pulled her up,i also notice at some point all the way through this whole thread,you have slammed everybody at some point,just an observation.Actually you are starting to sound awfully like someone elseon here who likes to put people down.Ireally do not see how this helps with improving the gsd. goodnight liz.

That feeling that missbeeb and DP are 1 in the same?

I heard he has done this before posting as 2 different people.

MISSBEEB, I cannot see or ever read a post where Peggy addressed SUE,so i cannot comment on that.I would not say Peggy has been negative just realistic. By saying" we are trying" do you mean the handful of posters on this thread,get real. By the way i was the one who mentioned honesty,but i meant eveybody involved in the breed,but that is never going to happen.Only yesterday there was a very interesting post taken of the board,WHY? because it contained truths,now in my book that is wrong.the post contained information that all gsd owners,breeders etc etc should know about. As to your last point we should all make an effort, i have never done anything else,and will continue to do so. Why do you think i brought up the health issues i have,and those who continue to "cover up" health issues IMO are not making an effort,how they can claim "they have the breed at heart " is beyond me. Missbeeb you may not be interested in"personal glory"but i am afraid there are some who are. WATCHER nothing on here would surprise me!!!!  Liz

Misbeeb

For the requirements of the diciplines and marking requirements foe the sch evaluation you can download from the DVG site (link in a previous post) each grade ie BH SCH1 etc is very detailed and the marking is explained, so for each minoe qualification which have only recently introduced TR1 is the SCH1 track etc etc.

Wildmoor

The prescribed test for work of our breed is sch not sport but evaluation, the GSD should be a versatile utility working dog, the sch evaluation was written to aid that, the temperament of the dog is tested, its socialability its ability to concentrate and be biddable its athletasism,prey drive courage etc, GENERALLY speaking if a dog will do all that and has been socialised it SHOULD do almost anything you ask of it.

You should also note that before you can take part in a sch evalution the dog must have passed the BH test which if you take the time to read you will see that the socialability is tested.

Misbeeb

Whilst i understand that a lot of people do not want to get involved in sch if you were on the continent you would have little choice if you expected the local KC to offer you the same privilage of  registration as the breeders that breed in accordance with their BREED CLUBS requirements

I for one would like to get back to the title of the thread and will over the next few days have a think about a realistic schedule of improvement, in the workability side, iam sure you will see from my posting it will not be as correct from a grammar spelling or english point of view but it will be fairly and carefully thought out and i will endeavour to demenstrated its viability

R

Reason, I'll look forward to it, thanks.  I'm also looking forward to visiting South Valley.

Liz, now that I've recovered from the "vision" of being DP... Peggy's comments (re: Nacale)were also zapped, I have no idea if she removed them herself or if some "other" is responsible.  The post is still on here, (2nd Sept) there's just nothing in it now!  However, Sue B's reply is still available, so Peggy has had some "success", has she not?   Sue B is knowledgeable, useful and helpful.

I read the posts you refer to yesterday, I don't know if everything/anything on there was true but if even a little of it was true, it can only add to the case for introducing a proposal/2 tier registration system... it may be a little ironic that DP wrote the proposal.

The real reason that nothing changes, often boils down to people giving up because of constant negativity and nit-picking by those who have no intention of helping.  Why?  I truly do not know!

I have been rather acid at times (mainly born from frustration) but I make no apologies for standing up for myself or my breed.  If, as you and a few others predict, we get nowhere with this proposal, it won't be for the want of trying!

MISSBEEB,i to make no apologies for myself or my breed,and i have wished you luck with your proposals.I personally do not think it goes far enough.To raise the minimum hip score is a step back in my opinion.You do not have to lecture me on Sue,when i was into the show scene,my dogs were judged under her and i have the greatest respect for her. Having not been "involved" in the show scene for at least 9 years and not spoken or seen her in that time,i do not need any one to tell me about Sue.And i am sorry but the reason nothing changes is still IMHO dishonest breeders.  REASON the last time i looked i was in SCOTLAND not THE CONTINENT i am very happy about that. I too would like to get back to the topic,now what was it the OP asked, oh yes "How about sensible suggestions on here as to what could/should be implemented to improve the breed/BREEDERS etc." I have suggested BREEDERS are 100% about health of thier dogs,like diseases that nobody wants to talk about. I also agree about the gsd being a working dog,but this has turned into a sch. thread,i am sorry guys but there are thousands of us that are just not into that. But i admire those who have the dedication needed for this,just a shame that admiration can't work both ways,i.e. those that choose to work thier dogs in another field. liz

Liz

So before i start my suggestions could you be so kind as to share yours, and were appropriate they could be included, but please remember the GSD is a utility working dog and ALL the testing should be based on the drives i have previously detailed,and which are carefully evaluated in the procedure used by almost the rest of the world

ie  its socialability its ability to concentrate and be biddable its athletasism,prey drive courage etc,

Bancroft

You are absolutely spot on if a GSD cant do a BH it is not even a GSD and should not be bred from, or it should have privleges above those that are bred without

Hi reason

I have read the BH in the past, if a dog is conditioned through repetative training to behave in a certain way it will but only under those enviroments it is conditioned in, take that same dog out of that enviroment  (comfort zone) and it will react differently.

for example; a dog who only meets other dogs at training or shows and no where else esp if it is only socialised with the one breed, will behave very different at shows/clubs to how it will in real life.

Liz

You have made a good point the GSD has a herding test dicipline which is valued in the breeding programme it is HGH

However it is rarely in comparision to sch done by the continentals due to the impracticality, the same as it would be in this country however if you wish and think others should follow that programme detail it propose it evaluate it, or accept that it may be a bridge to far for now or even in the future, i live in a farming community and i am sure that all the local farmer would be aghast and against me trying to train my dogs to work without damaging their livelihood

Yes the GSD should be able to do a VARIETY of dogs that is why the sch EVALUATION tests the basic drives of the dog

There are two kinds of sch particuarly on the continent there are the people that just train for breeding evaluation, and the competitors two very different sets of people, i train for competition and i train with some people that only wish to qualify their dogs we train the same basics but the competitiors by their nature try harder to get the best from their dogs and the other look to qualify with more than the min required

Mental and Physical health is paramount for the sports trainers as their dogs are expected to work harder

I will however continue to try to educate from my junkie type fog on all issues relating to the health of the GSD despite being put down by some