Culling pups from the litter - Page 4

 Leffew, I don't think EBs should exist. And hell, they wouldn't, if it weren't for ridiculous measures taken before, during, and after whelping, I mean c-sections (puke).

From what I understand there are noble old breeds that probably only exist today because of the c-section. What does that say?

 To me, it says they shouldn't exist, period.

Now, I know everyone's gonna jump all over me and try to bring human c-sections into this, but a breed that as a whole, cannot reproduce naturally, is plagued with a myriad of health problems it's entire short life of 7-9 years (or however long those miserable "bulldogs" live) should not exist. I honestly don't think it's fair to the dog and I think the people creating and perpetuating this horribly deformed breed really need psychiatric help. 

Haha, that's what I guessed you would say. I do not like EBs at all, but I really don't care if people want to own them. I do, in general, feel sorry for them. And, though I would all I could to help a litter of puppies, I would never breed a dog that, well, couldn't even breed! Poor ugly dogs. :( And you're right, if they was no human involvment, in  fifteen years they're wouldn't be any EBs, or French Bulldogs, or Boston Terriers, ect.

Beetree, I don't think c-sections were necessary for bulldogs until recently, when they're standards were pushed over the limit. From the pictures I've seen, the old bulldogs hardly resemble the newer ones at all.

 Well, in fairness, some of those can breed ok, sometimes- EBs are not among them, generally speaking.

I do care if someone wants to own an animal that has been so genetically modified, the dog is literally in some type of misery its entire life. I don't think that's fair. To each their own applies only if its a victimless crime, IMO.

Actually, I was thinking more along the lines of a larger breed like the Irish Wolf Hound, and that just proves there are many old, distinguished breeds in dire genetic trouble. Scary to think, because could there be a "shelf life" for man's interference?

I hate to get off topic (sorry, OP!), but, oh well.

Jenni: But can all of those whelp without c-sections? I really don't know, I never plan on even owning those breeds, much less breeding them. But I'm pretty sure both the EB and the FB can't normally do either, and I was thinking that the Boston Terrier couldn't whelp without help (hehe, that rhymed).

The bulldogs I've met seemed happy enough. If the dogs are living horrible lives due to their genetics, and the person still breeds them, then I would have a problem. Which maybe they do. Maybe I need to sit down and think about this for a little while. I bet they don't cull any, after all the work just to make them, though. lol


beetree: Sorry, I misunderstood. :) But I'm a little confused, do Irish Wolfhounds need c-sections? Or am I missing something again (which is very likely) ? I do like those, they are beautiful dogs.

Many breeds cull due to standards Rottweillers  if there is white  on them, Boxers if not flash or too much flash, Ridgebacks if there is no ridge of hair.  Back in the day Geman Shepherds that were born with long hair were culled because the standard said it was a flaw, a white shepherd, or a shepherd with a lot of white were culled

The one breed that comes to mind is bull dogs  for C-sections. They can not pass them naturally (if breed to the code)  and must be C-section and without mans help the breed would not be with us today.

Beetree: Wow, I didn't know that. Do you know why that is; in other words, what causes the dog to not give easy births? I thought they weren't that rare, too (that's only because I know someone with one, and have heard about them, so I just assumed). I'd hate to imagine what they are doing for the really rare breeds.

Crap, I'm still off topic... so, what about other methods of 'culling?' Even in the given scenario, with 9+ puppies, you could give some to a breeder who only had one or two pups, and everyone would benefit. You wouldn't run the risk of killing off an excellent dog, and they would have more puppies to keep theirs warm and socialized. Just a thought. :)