Top Showlines with good protection phase - Page 33

Lyda,

Can you comment on any of Gucci's offspring or contribute anything about his breeder?

This is definitely been a very educational thread.....

However it is always good to have a reality check.... and there is no better opprtunity for that than the very unique event that is slated to happen at the two ends of this country...

For the next 3 days: May 27-28-29 in Colorado in the West & in Pennsylvania in East..... 2 groups of dogs will compete on the basis of the best combination of structure and working ability in an event that combines both complete field work at the SchH3 level as well as formal ring work in a conformation evaluation....
http://www.highplainscolorado.com/USShow.htm

http://wdanusc.org/

These 2 events are perfect for anyone who is interested in gaining an understanding what is truly required in a dog to display structure that does not interfere with an ability to work and to also comprehend what is meant by temperament in a working capable german shepherd.

At the end of the day all the analysis one may do and the theorizing over bloodlines and pedigrees will boil down to the performance of individual specimen dogs on the field.....where they and their handlers show the watching public and the Internet analysts.... the classic statement .... "SHOW ME THE MONEY"!!!!

lonewolf, it will always come down to what is on the fuzzy end of the leash, no matter the venue. I know you have lobbied pretty hard for some changes that I feel would be very beneficial to the breed in the U.S. Hope you don't stop.

Any change in direction must come from the top down, as most breeders are going to breed what wins. And ultimately what benefits their program the most. And I do not fault any at all for this. I've been there and done that.

I do think that there are folks in the U.S., like you, Randy, Cindy, who are influential enough to hopefully get implemented true character assessments.

Undoubtedly, the best of the best of GSD comes from Germany. But that does not mean that we in the U.S. must follow blindly into this contest of gait and beauty first. One need only look to the American Show Shepherd to see where this will ultimately lead.

Thank you for your efforts and contribution here. I'm sure there are other novices like me who it does not fall on deaf ears.

best,
Rick Atchley

Let's take a break. We've identified some lines and dogs that work. It's out there, many have known where it is many have not. This exercise has derived the formula to a degree.

So,,,what happens when you do get a dog that works. Another Jaguar, Lauis, Xasko, Jeck, etc. What are the chances of the dog reaching it's potential? Of all the dogs that have it, what does it take to get it there?

Ravi, You've had a very successful career with Juneau. Can you elaborate?

Thanks Rik.....

 Randy.... I will post something later.... but first why don't you also ask Kevin Nance who is acxtively competing with his showline at pretty much the same levels and also Karen Sinclair who is currently competing with her HOT dog.

In the meanwhile regarding your question.... "What does it take to get there"?

the answer is..... BOTH THE DOG AND THE HANDLER NEED TO FIRST GET OFF THER BEHINDS AND OFF THE COUCH!!!!

Hi Randy:  I am thinking your question over,  will get back to you...Lida

To answer Randy's question.... "what happens when you do get a dog that works. Another Jaguar, Lauis, Xasko, Jeck, etc. What are the chances of the dog reaching it's potential? Of all the dogs that have it, what does it take to get it there?"

.... with one of my own: "what happens when you do get a dog with VA quality structure, another Yasko, Enzo, Zamp, Dux.... What are the chances of that dog reaching its potential? Of all the dogs that have it (VA-grade structure), what does it take to get it there?"

AND THE ANSWER IS:
For the dog with VA potential---- You campaign... you show, train for the ring..... you carefully pick the judges and build a track record of wins....you form breeding alliances.... you network with other breeders & support them and their programs by breeding to their males (of course when the genetics match your dam obviously)....AND they in turn support you by breeding to your male (when the genetics suit what they have got of course).... you sell puppies from your  breedings and work with your puppy buyers to assist them in raising them well and coach them in showing in your progeny groups..... you travel, go to Germany.... visit with SV Judges... be seen and see others... build a track record as a person serious in promoting and of course "breeding to better the breed".... you purchase potential studs or brood bitches and in this manner develop lasting relationships among the movers and players of the show world..... Mind you am only glossing over the most obvious aspects and I am sure that there is at least 3 times more depth to this...all of this is hard work no doubt, expensive too and definitely legitimate endeavors.....

Therefore for the showdog with working potential---- You train.... You find a good training club whose TD is willing to invest in the longer time it takes to train a novice....you travel upto 100 miles (one way) every week to the club.... you spend upto 12 hrs every week in training.... either alone with your dog in a rural field as you work the intracies of tracking or with your training group at your club.... and you will do this from the age of 9-10 months till the dogs 2nd year when you will face your first test the BH at or after 15 months of age.... (assuming that you do this honestly yourself)... and then if you have trained diligently and wisely and under comptetent training guidance then you will trial and earn your SchH1 title before the dog is 24 months old.... after that the ScH2 title around 30 months and the highly coveted SchH 3 title by 36 months..... but if you are doing all this for the first time and you want to go the honest route then do not be surprised and indeed congratulate yourself if you acheive the SchH3 before the dog's 4th birthday....

... and you will do all this while maintaining your day job and everything else that life throws at you....In my club I have seen seasoned people with very strong working dogs not reach the SchH3 title level until after the dog is 4 years simply because of any number of variables that comes up along the way....

... Of course along the way you have to show at a conformation show, do a AD, a breed survey, and then if you are going for the big leagues then you have to travel across the country to a Sieger show.... and you have to have a strong stomach and deep pockets for that too.....

If you're married you will either need your spouse (significant other if applicable) to be either involved actively with your effort or be extraordinarily understanding and who is willing to become a "Schutzhund Widow/Widower" in return for the passion that drives her/his partner.....

USA Univ. Sieger Trial

Dog	Track	Obed	Prot	ConformPoints	Total Points	Pedigree URL
Vandal v. Mittelwest	90			1		http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=625201
Gordon v Fuchsgraben	92			2		http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=617867
Lolita v haus Kiewel	70			1(female)		http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=430240

 

WDA Univ. Sieger Trial

Dog	Track	Obed	Prot	Conform. Points	Tot. Points	Pedigree URL
Iven Blue-Iris	PULLED	PULLED	PULLED	-----	-----	http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=499468
Zambo vom Riedschlurgi	92	96				http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=568619
Sit vom Holtkamper Hof	75	82				http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/german_shepherd_dog/dog.html?id=

Maybe it needs a good sized team of strong determined spirit. Well said Lonewulf.

Ibrahim