Question on the 5 trunk bloodlines of the GSD genealogy - Page 3

Thats the idea Susie. So Hettel who established the second trunk line can be traced back to from  present day dogs through their  accomplished ancetral  Sires. Along a partucluar trunk some dogs ( other than the founder ) have had a  distinct influence. ex: along Hettel's line, Alf Nordelson had 3 sons who were prominent: Gundo, Held Haus Elkeman, and  Venus Slarrenburg (  through came Nico and Fero ). So Alf did not found trunk line 2, but he was influential in that line.

ok Suzie I think I understand the point you were trying to make that Horand was born much before 1949 and he was picked because he was the dog that the current BSP dogs came from.

Mithuna, just try to count the generations between Hettel and now, and then try to find out how often the "lines" have been mixed because of douzends of different motherlines, whose sires have been out of different "lines", too.
Which "line" is the "good one" ???
At the end of this ask yourself a question: Do you like the present dog in front of you BECAUSE there are some milli% of Hettel in it, or do you like the dog ALTHOUGH there is Hettel somewhere in the dark past.

Susie, the dams had sires too.What did they produce?

There is a preponderance of observable evidence that certain lines are prepotent for certain traits.

I'd like to see everyone who buys into this sire line stuff, to breed a litter using exclusively males, and do it without cloning ( since the egg would need a uterus)....no females allowed being as y'all believe only her sires matter. mathuna, do you believe the story that its possible to recreate a dog such as hettel by line breeding on males with him way back in the distant past?

Yeah all pups in a litter are always true to the proposed traits the line represents....breeding is so simple:

X line = x traits,

y line = y traits


What could be simpler, no need to test dogs at all.

Simple people believe the simplest answers.


Biggest bunch of marketing BS I ever heard, and people buy it.

I looked at America,s version of BSP and found only several that looked to be USA born,maybe a couple had AKC on both the parents but that does not even mean the parents were USA born,many get AKC once they come to USA, for most of the dogs the genes fed into the European blood real fast or they were European born,that was for USA national trials for year 2014 so a chart for America born dogs would be pointless or at least far too small,USA kennels have a lot of catching up to do.

Cordon an sat was a preponent sire from the second line. His son Tom zps is also a preponent line 2 dog. The line 2 dogs were generalized as " sable, hard, in PP high anger level, great trackers, dominant thus lesser obedience" I have a dog from the second sireline who is displaying these traits. However his pedigree is influenced by many other lines mostly the 2nd. Like all other modern GSD his pedigree has multiple lines. It is thought by some that this form of breeding within the line is obsolete. I do know some who still do this and have great success (mostly Czech lines)!!

hettel was of questionable temperament at best and if not for alf and mutz, other than alex-erich-klodo of course, he wouldn't be on anybody's line/trunk at all. yet, neither alf nor mutz were particularly representative of hettel. so i never quite understood how a dog, who's 'represented essentially through one off-branch son, alf, who in turn is linebred (only) 5-5 on gockel, which gets you back to hettel but over utz and klodo, both 'trunk holders' in their own right and also not particularly representative of hettel, gets that much play.
if you want to stick with the five-line-count, it should be roland, not hettel. if not for gunter, as well as gretel, leading to the temporary illusion of an uckermark line, and if spielmann had his cards played a little better, that would have been the case.

In maths this would be called an overdetermined problem, you can get any solution. In psychology it is ink blots, everyone will see whatever they happen to see.

Surprised nobody has bought up the extinct first line resurrected through Javir but not any of his siblings.