dogs bred for looks lose mental bite - Page 3

High Desert I'm not sure where you are getting your information.  On this side of the Atlantic, we can see the very proof of the topic of this thread in the ASS (American Show Shepherd), which has been bred for no other purpose than to trot around a ring in one direction.  This is exactly what happens when breeders no longer care about the dogs' function or his brain.  This has resulted in the overwhelming majority of  ASSes becoming  very skittish fear biters which makes them much more dangerous, than any high drive working line dog or any German High Line dog.  These same traits render the ASS useless.   Imported dogs are not aggressive as a rule; however as a rule, they  are much more stable than their American counterparts, which makes them all the more successful in working, whether that be in police, SAR,  sport, etc.. 

Kenneling a dog is a choice because of owning multiple dogs, not wanting dogs in the house, not wanting the dog to have the run of the entire yard, or because kenneling can bring drives up for training, etc..  I promise you, you won't find most high drive working line GSDs kenneled because they are too high drive or out of control.

My American showline girl is useful to me. She is a very alert and discriminating watch dog. I think practically this is quite enough on my suburban lot.

Most important to me, however, she is a beautiful pet. Sorry, but she has beautiful straigtht back. Excellent and balanced angulation. Great dentation. a Gorgeous female head, Firm midsection. Thick pads on paws, well arched feet. Just excellent conformation. She trots for miles in each exercise session. An animal lover sees this as a very appealling animal.

All the pups from her are already spoken for. Perpective buyers see beauty in all hers and the sires pedigree. I forthrightly told them that the American Showline GSD is basically a pet that doubles for some protection. If they want protection predominantly, get an import and be committed in training it well. I don't ask for much, just half of what many imported pups sell for, half of about $1800.

There are more imports that are sheer too aggressive than American "Fear biters". 

Mine is not a fear biter; she may be a non-biter except really pressed, either her or me being assaulted.

This bias against either type or line is foolish.

There are many GREAT imports; yes and they generally have greater nerve and working abilities. That is why I will likely get one in a couple of years.  There are also many unpleasant situations with imports, too much dog for the average family.

The great majority of urban families is better with an excellent American GSD. A dog is first and foremost a pet! It should be among the most valuable thing you own, not to protect the things you own. The only thing more important is yourself and your family, not your other things.

I'm glad for you that your American line dog is an exception to the rule, you are lucky you got one of the rare good ones.

HIGHDESERTGSD, Not being disrespectful, but I would wager that you donot have, nor have read, the "German Shepherd , In Word in Picture" by the founder of the breed. Because if you had, you would have felt his passion and committment to his creation remaining a "Working dog". I would also venture that you have never done any meaningful training of the German Shepherd to see its natural brillance. This to me is like when segments of a population are not educated.....I think it is the responsibility of the owner to educate/train in either situation. People who breed the German shepherd to not possess the traits the standard calls for, is like people breeding labradors that don't like water because they want to live in the desert. It is wrong, selfish, and destructive to the breed as it was created. Everybody should not own a German Shepherd, rather it is because they can't handle one or because they don't live in an environment that is condusive, with their handling skills. Either way to change the breed to meet our personal desires is incredibly selfish. BTW, most American shepherds couldn't lead the blind that's why they don't anymore....would you want to risk you wellbeing on a dog that when in public, say a car backfires or tractor trailers are bounding down the street you are on the end of a leash with a dog with that "worried" look. This is so sad what people have done to this noble breed!!

Bull Terrier Skull over Decades...Changes due to Priorities for Conformation SHOWs, Rather than Work, which the breed was designed for earlier on..



1930s Bullies, Notice egg shape head


Of all the dog breeds currently being “improved,”  none is more inbred than the bull terrier. It is also one of the earliest breeds introduced into to the institutionalized dog fancy. In fact, but for dog shows and the institutionalized fancy, this breed would not exist at all. (The study that found the bull terrier to be so inbred can be found here , and another analysis can be found at terrierman, where the breed of choice is the Jack Russell, the least inbred dog.)

Modern Show Dog

Actually, the main problem with many GSD's, in sum total, kept in the USA is indiscriminate breeding. It is natural that the line most eroded is the originally American line. I meant both head screwed on tight so breed breeders. "Both parents on Premise" is a taletell sign. A small time breeder should get an outside champion stud.

Winning in an American show does show stable mentality. Yes, A stranger called the judge opens your mouth to inspect your dentation.  A confident outdoing mentality influences the American AKC judge.

Both parents and all four grandparents of my girl and the sire are champions and/or ROM. The sire is confident  and outgoing, yet retains strong protective instinct, but after an hour or so becomes mellow.

The pups in this litter are EXPECTED to have stable mentality. They are expected to be mellow and don't have high drive also.

There are far fewer indiscriminately bred recent imports. The reasons are obvious. One pays $1500-$2500 for such a female pup and when she is ready to be bred one chooses the stud with care. Owners of imports are more serious and knowledgeable as well.

Two of my girl's sisters went to SAR homes nonetheless.

One last shot: many people want the GSD for its natural protective instinct, natural great looks, fluid movements. Many lines have different combinations and different extents of each characteristics. The idea of 'Breed Purpose" is a fallacy. It is now 2009, many urban families want a GREAT LOOKING pet that appeals to the visual senses, a GREAT mover, and just some protective value.

What needs to change is the "orignal intent" of the founder. Besides, many imports are even more high drive and aggressive than the original intent of the founder, I think.

To me, the most important are LOOKS (conformation), and a stable and affectionate mentality. Great working abilities also have its appeal and I will likely get an import later, but it must have acceptable appearance. After being accustomed to the top American showline beauty, it is hard to accept the appearance of many imports. Some look like deformed cooked-shrimp, but there are some fairly good looking ones, occasionally, even with a slightly roach back. I am looking.

end of story--don't want to offend more people, just can't stand slander on the American line.

Highdesertgsd, no problem...I feel kinda foolish because i see most of the successful, knowledgeable breeders on this forum haven't even bothered to comment on these views...i probably should'nt have either. Peace!!

Beauty is, as Beauty does.

Showlines dogs  that cant work, should ALL be neutered or spolit off in a separate registry.

'Great Working abilities also have their appeal'?   Thats the entire  reason for existance  in the GSD. To Work!

Its no wonder the breed is at a  crossroads, and lingering a slow death

Uglydog

Thanks so much for the visual on the bull terrier.  It is another perfect example of what happens when we breed for looks alone.

Deb

Actually,

If need be within one's breed program, a dog genotype is less complicated than other species,
and can be altered for better or worse after just 3 generations.......