Czech GSD's with bad hips - Page 24

Johann unless a breeder has every dog from a litter xrayed and sufficient numbers of litters to give credibility to the analysis, then it is difficult to say that kennels are producing 90% HD free progeny. Is it possible ....surely, but trust me if there was a formula that consistently produced 90% HD free progeny and good working traits, then the world would be running to this source for dogs. Truthfully, if thats the case they should share the dog's pedigree, the breeding practices, and the accomplishments for everyone to see. You cant keep a secret like that in this world of hip heartbreak.  I would gladly like to become aware of these kennels.
It has been my experience over the years,(remember i live in fantasy world...lol), that many of the dogs with superior  temperament and the ability to produce superior temperament, often have a greater propensity to produce dysplastic dogs, especially when linebred. Of course that could be my imagination, but in both German and Czech lines I have found this to be true. There are dogs and lines that are known for great working ability but you cannot linebreed on them or you will see your HD or Elbows become a greater issue. There are also dogs that with extensive breedins have shown to have a higher percent of acceptable hip rating than average. My point is in trying to produce the total dog it requires having to deal with the devil sometimes to offset the place youare in with your line or dog. For some this is called compensation breeding....it has long been a necessity in the breed because of the diverse makeup of the breed, is such that when you load the deck too far one way.....other evils crop up that ultimately change the very nature of the dog or breed.  My fear is when you breed based purely on empirical evidence for structural perfection; which cannot be attained.....then greater evils occur.
But my biggest fear is that there are so many quote, unquote reputable breeders today that advertise and promote their reputableness on the fact that they have certified stock. People dont have clue as to bloodlines, genetics, and history of production of the dogs they are using, BUT they have Sch 3 KK1 dogs so they are reputable and this is an approved breeding! Pleaseeeeeee! If this is the answer, then the WGSL dogs should be the healthiest, strongest, most sound tempered German Shepherds out there, with the best hip production.....period! You cant have it both ways in you preach the salvation of of all this empirical testing being necessary to maintain our place in breed world and explain what I see today in hips or other things....I cant reconcile what I see with what people are drumming into my head......but when I start seeing these kennels producing 90% HD free dogs with good workability, then you can believe I will adjust my thinking to come to their side of the fence. LOL
And lastly, since there are so few really thoroughly knowledgable breeders these days, I understand the necessity of the need to see hip and elbows rarings, but dont malign the old school people who it is clear have the knowledge and ethics and passion for the breed. JMO.

Ok Hans,

Back to the topic...

Given your in depth knowledge and many, many years of breeding, kindly share some light...

Kindly use the link below; this is a mating check between Urf and Para z Jirkova Dvora...

If a puppy out of this combination ends up with severe hips, where would you say the bad hips are coming from?
Given the fact that you know these two dogs and their ancestors, siblings very well...


http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/breeding.result?father=617029&mother=714845

Could someone explain to me why there would be a concern for "severe HD" from this breeding. I am not by any means an expert actually consider myself uneducated in pedigrees and genetics so I am trying to understand what the problem is with this breeding .

Johan77 I think, no I know that 90% or better of HD free progeny  is possible.  That is what I am talking about. I have those numbers here. It isd not that heart if you do certain research and use it.  The problem is that it is only few breeders  who achieve that. On the other hand OFA can do so much more and does not.   Someone said that I do insist that people whose peds  I evaluate have all hips data present, but then I talk against OFA. I do not talk against OFA I talk against using OFA as only means of evaluating hips and I am pointing out what needs to be done to make the system actually work.   And yes, I do say that ped send to me for evaluation should have the hips data. But I do not care if it is official stamp or x rays attached to the dog. As a matter of fact I prefer the x rays over official stamp.
  In my younger years  I used to do little rock claiming and my teacher told me  not to depend  on vegetation when you climb. So I would not touch any. When my teacher noticed that he said. I did not tell you not to use it I told you not to depend on it. It is the same   with OFA.  If available you may use it but do not depend on it. 

http://www.offa.org/

OFA offers plenty of information to the dog world. It's up to breeders what they use (or don't).

Aadilah07 I would be happy to. But this is a hypothetical question and I need more info first.  I belive you are talking about this dog.
http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/dog.html?id=1888531
Am I correct?
Would you kindly post the picture of the hips of this dog  you are asking about?
Next how many generations  would you like me to go. I do not want to be flippant but the obvious answer to your question is the parents.

http://www.caninehealthinfo.org/brdreqs.html?breed=GS

OFA Breed-specific tests for GSD's. How many GSD owners/breeders are actually taking advantage of what OFA offers? And we expect more from them?

Blitzen said:
OFA offers plenty of information to the dog world. It's up to breeders what they use (or don't).

Yes you can use them. The question remains  ,... can you rely on them? 

You can rely on the CHIC results to be correct as reported to the OFA by the examining veterinary specialist or certified temperament evaluator.  It's up to the breeders to fnd out the result of those tests and to decide how to apply them to their own breeding programs (or not). There are many other tests on the OFA site in addition to the few that are needed for the CHIC cert. Most aren't going to need or want to use many of them, they will be considered window dressing,  but they are available none the less.

Here is from Chic/ OFA example of severely dysplastic dog.  Dog is dysplastic indeed. BUT! Please note the horrific positioning and no presence of knee caps. Is this a text book example? Did not have OFA properly positioned dog. This is what I am talking about. If this is sloppy what else is sloppy?!
http://www.offa.org/hd_info.html