Here we go again - Page 2

It appears to me as though the "Helpers" were told how to work these dogs...I mean I don't like the "stick" work...but it was consistent and the dogs didn't seem to understand what was going to happen...Another words they weren't introduced and trained for this type of "stick" work...or this is the Personality and Temperament of the dogs...

As long as the "Helpers" are consistent...then they're doing their job...They are instructed by the judges on how they want the dogs worked...So I don't think it's the "Helpers" fault for how they worked the dogs...

In a Trial or Event...The "Helpers" AREN'T working for the dog/handler...They're working for the Judges...

~Bob~

Is there any chance the owners/trainers of these failed dogs entered them knowing they would probably not pass their bitework? Why would anyone do that at a show like the BSZS?

The owners of the dog I garentee they have seen this before in their dog in traning .Dogs coming off sleeves some not even getting a bite .embarrassing I think not owners would have to have some standers and resept for them self and the decoy . These dog's are a discrace and more than likely well titled probably classed as best studs out there.i am angry watching this wonder why the breed is fu@@@@ and why show line get such a hard time we'll there is your answer.the dogs are shite . and the owners don't care as long as they title what a joke

Second video even worse one dog sent for the bite 3 times .Blond women wouldn't even come back to her .What crap

I really don't understand why an owner/trainer would enter a dog like that if the dog has  consistently given poor bitework.  It sure doesn't help improve the reputation of GSL's.

Its called 'a hope and a prayer'....even dogs who barely bite are announced 'Pronounced' by the judges. To answer your question; the dogs are so inconsistent that the people responsible for entering them take the chance because the owners don't know their dog is going to run off...they are shown performances of their dog working with a familiar helper, on familiar field and owner is clueless to the reality of their dog's true temperament. Also, remember that the owners have these dogs at a 'show kennel', paying lots of money for training. The owners get reports from the trainers telling how fabulous the dog is performing...the owners are pumped up about the 'big show' and big stud fees and glory..all the while the 'trainer/show kennel collects a bunch of money for showing the dog, the handler gets a huge paycheck and it's politically correct to 'tip' the handler generously win or loose. So the money coming from the owner to the show kennel/trainer and handler is why these dogs are entered...follow the money. I saw the same thing at the two international seiger shows my dog was entered in...and the performance of the dogs back then was not a horrible as even the 'pass' dogs at this show...things can't help but go down hill for the breed when the 'best of the best' have the standards lowered year after year just to get some dogs to pass. Its the judges who are rewarding the poor performances and causing them to be propped up.

Blitz they have no choice the the standard of show line is that bad .It makes me laugh when owners or trainer's defend the dogs. how are these trainers still getting dog if they are supposeble telling the owners the dogs are super bad news travels fast .owners don't give a shit as long as they title so they can get bigger money to breed more shite dog's.This and other videos like show why SL are not through GS. By the looks of it they are breed to fail. Money titles money and that's all that matters

I think one must keep in mind, that bie work (as it were) is of little merit to the owners of these dogs. So it's not such an imbarrasment to have the dog run off by a stick waving over his head. What matters is gait and color....bottom line.

It´s slightly different, Joan. Over here at least the German dogs are mostly handled by the owner or by someone out of a "team" who is responsible for the dog, and It´s very disappointig and embarrassing for the handler to fail. I was at my first Siegershow around 1980, the standards are not lowered, they became stricter ( a lot ) during the years.
Why are these dogs entered? Simple answer - the dogs participating on the German Siegershow are high rated dogs out of the young and youth dog classes, the runner ups.
Anybody who wants to "make" his dog a worthful stud male MUST participate, otherwise no studs/no money. The owners know exactly what they do.
They hope for the best, either because they want to achieve a high rating, or because they want to sell the dog for a lot of money.
It´s like gambling - a youth class winner is worth maybe 150 000 Euro, in case they don´t show the dog in the working dog class, the dog suddenly is worth only 10% of that amount.
There are two possibilities: Either you sell right after the young/youth dog class or you hope for the best. In case the dog fails, he is still good for the 10%: a lot of people outside of Europe don´t care about bitework...

I really like the bitework on the Siegershow, everybody who is able to "read" a dog, is able to weed out the weak dogs, no matter which rating.
That said any breeder looking for good showlines is able to make his choice. I never understood why breeders are willing to use weak studs...

Thank you, Susie. As you can tell, its very different here in the states. But the common denominator is money, no matter which scenario the dog is handled under.