2010 USA Sieger Show, Lake Geneva WI.

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by Louise M. Penery on 04 June 2010 - 17:06

One of these days, USA may select a venue aand season with decent weather for a show. Today, the forecast for Lake Geneva includes rain, wind, snf thunder. As a spectator, I had my fill of that in Chicago last year and have better ways of spending my money. Besides, who wants to show a male under the JA author?

I can recall several Sieger Shows held in California during the summer months rather than during a rainy spring. Yes, I know that scheduling theUSA SS during the spring has something to do with working dog trials which are held later in the year.

by Keith Grossman on 04 June 2010 - 17:06

"There's defiicits everyhwere. There are a few that are good, but a sprinkling few that I've ever seen in relation to the poor ones. and the good ones aren't the ones being pimped, bred, promoted or winning many shows. Plain and simple, most of the good working showlines are the ones that showline breeders don't seem to want to breed to. Funny how that works."

Sorry but I'm going to have to call bullshit. When Steve House was campaigning Indo (http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/447934.html) people were lined up to breed their bitches to him primarily because of his work so the assertion that showline breeders don't want to breed to those dogs is incorrect.

by MaggieMae on 04 June 2010 - 17:06

Well -- I surmise that none who are angry about the "winners" have entered their dogs in the Show.   However, some appear to be on a Mission to get it on film and onto You Tube -- and the point being?

Instead of complaining about it, maybe it is about time to step-up-to-the-plate.    If you feel confident as a Trainer (or your hired Trainer) and feel confident about your dog's abilities, then I would really like to know why you did not enter your dog in the Show.

Human nature being what it is, it is so much easier to criticize those dogs that are entered into the Show and their Trainers, eh?    I just find this situation very interesting.

by Mystere on 04 June 2010 - 17:06

Actually, the SS is held in the spring because the MEMBERSHIP decided to hold it then and codified that decision.

The one change, AFAIK, was in 2004 (?), when it was decided to hold it in the fall, within a week of the National Championship. Of course, November anywhere in the country is likely to have "unfortunate" weather, too.

NO ONE, but the Canadians, seem intent on holding a Sieger Show in August, in high summer, when it is the hottest. It was so hot last year, that the Championship portion of the combined event had to be moved to 8 pm. ...and it was still near 80 even then!!

by Mystere on 04 June 2010 - 17:06

Keith,

Sorry, but you have poked one of my almost-pet peeves. Laius v Moorbeck was a VA show line dog who proved himself on the field...at the WUSV. Yet, show line breeders in this country did NOT breed to him. Every time I asked in person, on a forum or list why not, the response was always the same: "They moved to France." This was from people who ship bitches to Germany to be bred several times a year! Admittedly, I am a product of the American educational system, but I seem to recall that France is actually geographically between the US and Germany.

The other under-rated show stud was a VA at the same Canadian SS as Laius and also impressed with his performance--Manto (?) What ever happened to him? I believe he was owned by a major breeder in Virginia (?)

by MaggieMae on 04 June 2010 - 17:06

Manto

www.hausjuris.com/pages/manto.html

by Louise M. Penery on 04 June 2010 - 17:06

The one change, AFAIK, was in 2004 (?), when it was decided to hold it in the fall, within a week of the National Championship. Of course, November anywhere in the country is likely to have "unfortunate" weather, too.

I believe it is held in the spring so that people aspiring for their dogs to be Universal Sieger may have have been entered at Regional Trials and, otherwise , have scores to qualify for tahe Naataionals.

I attended the USA SS when it was held in the fall (very warm/ humid) in Nashville the week before the Nationals.

When does the USA mmbership have a chance to actually decide on anything?

Mystere,I've heard thaat there were genetic reasons (poor pigment, missing testicles) for not breeding to Laius. Otherwise, I can name many SL dogs without these faults and with good working abiliity that people fail to use at stud.

by zdog on 04 June 2010 - 18:06

you can call bullshit all you want. Indo was a very nice dog, he should have been bred to lots of good dogs. But his time has long passed for that. That's one, and i don't know how many litters he sired, but I do know he was a very nice dog. Ask Steve if he thinks the big show breeders, the ones that get top placements, sell all the puppies and make all the money and pimp their dogs everywhere are using the showline dogs that work for breeding. I have a feeling he'll say something similiar to what's already been said.

by wrestleman on 04 June 2010 - 19:06

There have to be a decent dog come up every once in a while. Its the odds, there are thousands and thousands of show-line pups produced in Germany , here and around the world. Once in a while you will get a genetic throw back that can work. But can they produce that?????

Its not just the bite work, its the obedience as well, sluggish not spirit very little drive and very slow. Not all but for th most its this way.

Lets face it in Germany you have a greater divide between show and work maybe more than here. I would love to have a nice black and red dog with the drive and gripping of a malinois but its just not there any more. I think from those lines its gone....too many years of breeding weak dogs to weak dogs to get color size and gate with no regard to work.

As for the weather they can always use the rain as an excuse as to why the dogs didn't look good in the bitework, or the thunder and lightening scared them.

by Keith Grossman on 04 June 2010 - 19:06

"Ask Steve if he thinks the big show breeders, the ones that get top placements, sell all the puppies and make all the money and pimp their dogs everywhere are using the showline dogs that work for breeding. I have a feeling he'll say something similiar to what's already been said."

I'm sure you're right...we sat in my kitchen a few months ago and had almost this exact same conversation and I also agree that many of the most visible players regard the work as nothing more than a nuisance requirement. Not all of us think that way, however, and when one paints the world with such a broad brush, we end up looking like them.

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