Dog Behaviorists - Page 11

As for Kinolog's statement that Certified animal behaviorists are NOT (dog) trainers, well that depends entirely on how the individual earns a living.  If they are a vet in a private practice or work in a university as a professor or researcher, than they can certainly get by doing aniamal behavior analysis only.  However, most of the ones I know whom are not vets or University staff also make money being trainers.  Its about income streams, total services offered to clients and the market demand, not some philosophical rift where a behaviorist will not stoop to the level of being a mere "trainer".   

99 out of 100 people do not know how or when to use one, I would just as soon not myself but there are times, situations.
It's not the wheel or sliced bread.
But that's a whole other topic.
So is teaching a dog about traffic and vehicles.

Maybe it was the way you said it, I dunno.

I have never found a choke to be a problem and never have needed a prong.
I always discourage amateurs from experimenting with e-collars.
Seen too many dogs messed up.

A very timely article and video posted by Yahoo outlining how academicly educated "Animal Behaviorist" are doing applied, real, field work that involves dogs, but is FULLY grounded in broad "Animal Behavior".  You can be assured that this program was not developed by a zookeeper with a two-year degree in zoo animal training, while certainly these short degree programs are good and serve a purpose (one school I atteneded had such a program), its not enough to fully design a successful program like the one shown here, today that requires BOTH an advanced gradaute degree and many years of hands-on experience.  This isn't "training", its something else entirely and in a setting like this, no advanced amateuer would ever get access:

http://shine.yahoo.com/pets/best-nanny-planet-dog-195500122.html

You think that's rocket science?
You aren't by any chance yourself a behaviorist are you?
You never did say what you did for a living.

I'll have to find the one about the goat who cared for the blind horse.

You think that's rocket science?
You aren't by any chance yourself a behaviorist are you?

Two Moons, back at you, why do you think its so simple?  You realize this isn't 1954, there are things like zoo licensing, bonding and insurance today.  ALL of which require certain staff, working under certain conditions, to be licensed, certified and/or degree holding.  This also doesn't even begin to cover operational/procedural edicts dictated by the grants funding these types of programs.  Its not a free for all.

This goes back to the whole, "if you had more formal educaiton" statement, where by having such, you would understand that despite situations having seemingly simple solutions, they cannot be solved in a simple manner, due to existing laws/regulations, codes, and cultural norms that unconditionally require adherence to complexity.  But Two Moons, I know you understand this otherwise you wouldn't have mentioned needing licenses etc for your own day to day work.  The more time goes on in America, the more rules they make, like I said this isn't 1954.  I'm not saying its better or worse, just that it is, what it is, today.

I fully understand how many things work in our overly structured society.
But that had nothing to do with my reaction or response.
Let's just say i'm not easily impressed.

Some of it is very simple and very basic and it is not rocket science pardon the term.
To say you must have paper to be taken seriously or too suceed is only true in specific sandboxes, there is another world out there besides the one you seem to think rules everything.

There is nothing wrong with an education, but it isn't the only thing that matters.
Look at schools today, kids are tested on what they can memorize, not what they understand, and it's one size fits all.
How many great discoveries would be lost if they were lost because the mind behind them didn't have a piece of paper.

There is a wonderful story about the goat who cared for the blind horse, the horse finally died and some time later so did the goat.
Animals can amaze even the experts with behavior they will never undestand.
 

I have seen a number of behaviorists with a background in training marine animals, orcas especially, that condemn any non positive methods. Yet they overlook the fact that these orcas are usually kept in solitude, in tanks far too small with very little stimulation other than what they get from interacting with the trainers. The social and sensory deprivation causes a much stronger motivation to learn and interact. Couple that with the fact that these animals often are only fed when they work, and you have a training scenario that, though I feel it's cruel, is successful in teaching new skills. It's not a formula I would ever mimic for working with dogs, or any other animal for that matter.