2010 USA Sieger Show, Lake Geneva WI. - Page 11

I'll check with the wife to see if one's available, she's got a working agility seminar here this weekend.  She's got one of those sneaky spy flip video contraptions.

 The beauty of the German Shepherd is in it,s utility.
 
I would think that thunderstorms would help the show that way they could say "My litle Black and Red beauty slipped off the sleeve becuase it was wet from the rain"  and if it,s raining it will be harder to see the dogs pissing them selfs on the working field! so that is a plus for them also. 

I don't have a quality enough camera to video, but I have a friend who might. And believe me, she has cajones.

Phil, is the measure of a strong dog based soley on schutzhund? Can a dog not have the intense speed necessary to score high in sport and still be a drivey, powerful, strong nerved, clear headed, worthy dog? 

Again, I go back the poor image showlines have that have been created by the showline community, through breeding itself and minimal training. Of course no top sport handler or trainer is going to choose their next working prospect based on piss poor Sieger Show "performance tests". It's a vicious circle.

I do not think show dogs look so bad in the bitework due to a minimal amount of training. It is due to years of breeding for color and structure and not working ability.  As stated by Bob the beauty of the Shepherd is in its utility and the ability to WORK.
Lets face it there is a ton of money involved in show dogs and they keep getting worse with the years in their working ability. They have become Huge and  lethargic. Please people look on U-Tube at videos of the dogs that people brag about being such top show dogs and claim to have great bite work. Its very laughable many are sch 3 dogs.................................

It will only get worse due to the $$$$ involved and the fact that people spending these big $$$$ do not care about the working ability of the dogs. Its Color,Gait, and dollars to them.

Say what you want. There's a new sheriff in town. I just don't see Nathaniel Roque passing undeserving dogs in the protection test.

I am trying to understand the problem that some of you have with the Show Lines.   Is it the Bite Work only (the protection phase of the routine)?   Is it that you believe the Working Lines are not placed higher in a Show.   Are you basing it strictly on the full grip/not full grip Bite on the Sleeve?    

I believe that there is much more to the GSD than Bite Work.   I also believe that in a "real life" scenario, they will and can bite just as hard as a Working Line dog.   That is just MY opinion, so don't get all hysterical over what I say.   

no, but bitework is what "tests" the dogs courage and strength.  In these to areas they are very much lacking.  Plus it's more fun to talk about bitework.

but if you wan to talk about OB, there's a pretty big divide there as well.  Big, lopey, lagging, no drive, barely complete the exercise, no speed, no power over jumps , or drive back to the handler etc.

There's defiicits everyhwere.  There are a few that are good, but a sprinkling few that I've ever seen in relation to the poor ones.  and the good ones aren't the ones being pimped, bred, promoted or winning many shows.  Plain and simple, most of the good working showlines are the ones that showline breeders don't seem to want to breed to.  Funny how that works.

I think this is what tends to piss people off the most.  The dogs that are mostly crap, are touted as the best and pimped like high dollared whores.  While anything that can produce resepctable work, is largely forgotten when it comes to breeding or bragging.

Ok -- for the folks that are "pissed off" (per Zdog), are you entering your dog(s) into the Show?    If not - why not?