Got yourself an aloof GSD? Its your own fault - Page 11

All this complaining and name calling and am to am not stuff is getting no where.

You want to blame a source  for the current problem blame the major players not the lackies S.V., A.K.C. , U.S.A. it,s the governing bodies  of these orginization who allow there judges to pronounce "the winner is" thats the crux of this problem.

If these orginizations got the flak thrown at them that goes around this thread they would die tring to fix it So the next time one of you high and mighty holders of the torch start pointing fingers and calling names like 3rd graders just think when was the last time you picked up the phone or went up to a judge at a trial or called your orginization rep and said "hey enough is enough" call out those people and put them on the carpet before you scream at any one else. Find the real culpret and do some thing about it.   

But the real cuplret will be the ones with the biggest and deepest pockets...

Actually, Bob... I thought we'd kind of moved past the name calling etc?

msbeeb:

                   I was refering to the general tone of the thread, but yes the little nasties thru out the thread really arent called for by some. 

No name calling. I don't support any organization. I didn't even want to AKC my dog but some kennel club has to. I might yet move to UKC but they to will go corrupt, if not already. Any Org with too much power or too much $ will want more and do what they must to get more, never mind the consequences. I'll not waste my time fighting them, I'll do what I can to make what is out there work for me and my program, should I ever get one off the ground.

 So how does one effect change, It obvisouly has to be from within? how do you plan on title your dogs if you belong to no orginiazation?  Just wondering.

I just figured out the point of sueincc, etc. and I (sheepishly) stand firmly in her camp (I don't breed, by the way, but I do sheepherding with my GSD, and I had a wonderful friendship with a certified decoy in a French Ring club before moving out of the area so I like to think I have a VERY small understanding of grip work and how important it is to the GSD temperment). It's funny, though, how the original point of the thread, "aloof temperment" got mixed up with "breeding non-schutzhund titled GSD's" (unless I got THAT wrong, too; let the flaming begin again). Which, by the way, is making for a great debate!

We can get along Missbeeb, but, you can't acknowledge a practice that leads to negative results(KK1 dogs inferior in function to KK2 dogs), and yet continue to breed that way and honestly THINK you are an asset to the breed. The equation doesn't work this way, that's why the show dogs don't work as well, and we need to interject the type dogs that will fix this in order for the breed to stay a working breed. You can't do it by contiuing to breed the same black and red dogs going back to the same black and red dogs and expect the function to improve. Last 25 years has definitely proven this,as the showline temperament gets weaker and weaker, to now people rave when an isolated showdog IS a top performance dog. You can't love the breed and be complicit in furthering this trend. JMO

Hey, people don't have to agree ^_^ I'll take breeding my MACH UDX4 VST FH dig over the non titled dog, or the dog with just the CD.  Grip work just isn't possible for everybody.

Now, tell me where to find a good helper, or how to help another person find a teacher to teach THEM to become a helper so we can have more clubs and don't have to drive 3-6 hours in ONE direction to train and maybe we'll get somewhere.

Well Xeph, this statement takes the cake for the dumbest yet.  I'd like to know who out there has titled their dog to even a scHI  doing just "10 min of protection work".

Your anger makes me giggle ^_^ 

I've gone to a SchH club....very much enjoyed it, and so did my dog, I just couldn't continue to go...it wasn't cost effective.  I would drive down to Madison, and my dog would get worked between 5 and 10 minutes in protection.  It's not affordable to drive to a club for that small amount of work in ONE phase.  I can work obedience and  tracking on my own.

I very much enjoyed my time at that club, and would like to go back, but it's just not doable for everybody, and a dog with many titles that is being worked in some venue is much better than a dog who is worked in none, and I maintain that.  I certainly won't be breeding for "Crappy pets", but the dogs will certainly be ABLE to be pets.  I enjoy and admire a high drive dog, and have no desire to take away from that, but HGH herding is not available where I live, and when I can train in multiple sports for less, have a good time with my dog, and not have to take off work to train god knows where, I'm going to do it.

Schutzhund is a useful tool, and I've learned things about my dog I wouldn't have otherwise, but all that I have learned has not affected his status as a pet, or a sport dog, or a good German Shepherd Dog in general.  Schutzhund in that regard, has made absolutely no difference in my dog.

When some of us on PDB (and others) emailed the BBC to try to get them to support us in our quest to make it compulsary for all breeding stock to be surveyed (to inc a working test) and health checked before allowing any progeny to have the KC's crappy (but it's better than nothing & it's a start) enhanced pedigree, you Bancroft, were not atall interested in helping... when did you change your mind?  When it got a litle tight for you on here? 

"So how does one effect change, It obvisouly has to be from within? how do you plan on title your dogs if you belong to no orginiazation?  Just wondering."

I'll make my own change and let the rest of the world worry about the Orgs already in place or changing them. I don't have the time or energy to try and change something I may or may not have the power to. Move to a different Org like PSA? I know of some people making their own sport or breed tests for bulldogs, why not a new test for GSDs? I have to make a judgement call and do as best I can, to recreate the tests once placed on the breed and tweek them to fit todays lifestyle and what I want to see out of my dogs. If someone else doesn't think that's good enough, that's just fine with me. I may not even breed, when all is said and done but at least my personal dogs will be tested and I will know what I have or don't have.

In the US we have to do the best that we can and try to uphold some sort of structure and level of quality without the SV who I am not all that fond of anyway, due to rule changes, making tests easier, all for the sake of $ and numbers. USA is just an extension of that in the states. I'll OFA instead of A stamp so I don't have to pay fees to those Orgs just to get hips checked. I'll work my dogs in different sports and venues not just Sch. I'll do real world tracking like police do, even though it's not "required" in my sport of choice (yet). I'll do whatever kind of herding I can find. Right now it's on a friends ranch with cattle. The dogs exibit the right drives and control for that, that is about all I care about, no titles in herding needed as those wont be the jobs my dogs or pups will be placed in. I just want to know it's still there inside of them. The next guy may not care about the herding or  the tracking but I do care. I want to know it's there, so I will test for it.