Untitle Class at USA SS - Page 1

what do you all think about USA SS having a  24 months and older untitle class?

they will be adding this class for 2012.

I think it's a good idea to bring it back.
Lots of people just can't make it to the breed surveys/shows when they come up,
there are far more working trials held than shows/surveys,
so this will allow people to at least get that first rating done even if the dog is over 24mos.

Trialling and showing is hard in America, we are all so spread apart.
The average drive time for most is 90 minutes one way to train (good traffic),
and most only have so many vacation days to take etc to show/trial.
Most diehard working folks will choose a trial over a show/survey.

The dogs can't go V in that class.  Why not just combine it with an AKC show, they would have more entries?  What is really the point if you are following the SV style of breeding and showing?  If the dog is not titled under SV rules, it can not be breed surveyed and shouldn't be bred.  I suppose for folks that do not work or title their dogs or for dogs that can not be titled it would be a fun class to show your dog in.  Similar to the OB and  TR1, 2, 3 titles.  It may get more people involved in showing.  I'm on the fence, what benefit does it have that AKC shows don't offer? 

Slam, it will allow those coming in "new" to the sport with older dogs a chance at getting their feet wet.
I think the real reason behind it is a financial one, it will likely boost entries.
For most coming "late" to the game, or perhaps timing just being off, a class for 24+mos allows them to get up to SG
then go forward with titles etc. Or in some cases, people are more interested in the working titles than the show.

And yes, plenty will use it just to be able to advertise their untitled litters as "SG __________"
No working titles or hips/elbows, but what the heck right?

Maybe that should be part of the criteria for the class? OFA/A Stamp?

Well, I agree.  But, in the US as you know titles, OFA, A stamp, etc are not needed to breed dogs it is called the AKC.  I think it just dilutes the already watered down system we have here. 

Ratings earned in the 24+ untitled class do not count towards a breed survey.  You can't get a G or SG in that class and use that as your breed survey show card.  If a dog wants to breed survey and doesn't have a show card by 2 years, it will have to get titled and then show in the working class for G, SG, or V rating toward the breed survey.

So, I think the reason is just to boost entries and bring in more money.  At a Sieger Show, how costly is it to add just *one* mroe class?  It's not like they have to get another judge or more ring stewards.  Other than taking more time and needing a few more awards, there is no added cost.  So say it costs $50 to enter that class and you get 10 dogs.... there you have it.

I don't get what the AKC has to do with anything?  This is a totally different style of showing.  There is no comparison to AKC conformation regardless of the age level/class for SV shows.

VKGSDS,
 The comparision was showing a dog without titles in an adult class at the SS.  The dogs shown in AKC shows are not required to have any working titles, some may but it is not a requirement.  A dog can not be breed surveyed unless it has obtained a SchH 1, and done the AD.  Showing an untiltled dog has nothing to do with the Breed Survey. 


The reason is to definitely boost entries. 
Jim

I just wish that a dog over 3.5 could get a V in the working class with out having a breed survey.

In my case, I put a SchH1 on my male when he was 3.5.  But when I take him to his show, he can only get a SG because he doesn't have a breed survey yet.  But we cant do a breed survey on him because he doesn't have a show rating from the 12-24 month class.  So the max we can get on him is an SG.

My female 4 year old female has a ZVV1 title and can enter the working class as well, but cant get a V either because she has never gotten a breed survey nor a show rating.

Just silly if you ask me.

I was looking at the new USA magazine's show results page for last years shows, and saw that dogs in the Adult class had show ratings.  What is the difference?

Jim, you need a show rating to obtain a breed survey.  I've seen before where people intend to enter the open class for that rating, hence why I was throwing it out there for any lurkers.  The open class is for fun, for more ring practice, getting your dog more wins/awards, or putting a dog in front of specific judges.  There are lots of reasons to do it and it's always offered at club shows.  The Sieger Shows have been the exception.  The rating will not count towards a breed survey.  Lots of people aren't aware of this.

mfh, I'm in the same boat.  3 year old dog, earned SchH1 in November.  No shows within range before he hits 3.5.  He already has an SG from 13 months (show line dog).  There are so many stupid rules and "oh wait but...." things, why don't they just split the show classes by age or by title and leave it at that?