Schutzhund Training questions for the experts - Page 1

Hello,

I have a couple of questions in regards to schutzhund training. I know you can and should take your pup to the local schutzhund club to train (mine is about 45minutes to an hour each way) but what training can be done in addition to this? For example are there reputable dog trainers that will take your dog for a period of time and train them for a fee? If so what is a typical fee for this and what age would/should they start? How long does this process generally take? I know this depends on the dog but in general how long would this take as a ballpark figure. Also when to begin puppy imprinting and where can I get info on this?

Plus once the dog is ready for sch1 testing who does that? If I remember correctly the pup should have an AD and BH prior to attempting the schutzhund 1. Is that correct? Any help in regards to this would be greatly appreciated. BTW I am getting a couple of imports early June that will be approx 10 weeks old at that time and I am just trying to gather all the information I can as I want to give the pups the best opportunities to succeed as I can. I plan to show them and get involved in schutzhund. Public or private posts greatly appreciated! I know I have several questions and I hope you feel free to answer all or some of them:) 
 
Thanks again for taking the time to read this and sharing your thoughts,
 
Prodigy

There are trainers that will do the training for your dogs, but it's typically pricey. The length of time will depend on what you want trained. The fee will depend on how long, and how much training is to be done. The BH can not be until the dogs are 15 months old, and I believe the IPO1 at 18 months earliest. The AD is not a requirement for the IPO1, it is a requirement for a breed survey though. As far as who does the titles, you can do them at any club trial once you have a score book from either the DVG, USCA, or GSDCA-WDA and the dogs are age appropriate. If you have someone else do the titles, be prepared to spend $1,000 minimum per title, plus having the dogs with the trainer for many months.

I would suggest joining a club before the pups arrive. That way you can watch what others are doing and have a better idea of what to do once they do get here. The Training Director and club members can give you directions on what can and should be started early, and what should be left for later stages of training. Things such as playing tug of war with a rag is the start of bite development. Playing ball starts the retrieves, recall... You can use food to get them to start offering behaviors for obedience and to do puppy tracks for tracking. Without prior training experience, you'd be better off having a club to show you how to start with everything. They may even have pups there that you can watch going through the exact same stages that you will be going through.

IMO, don't let the pups lay around the house as typical pets the first year then expect them to title later on in life. Form the habits of a working dog early and get them to want and enjoy working with you. The first 16 weeks is an important time for imprinting, developing drives, and learning in general.

Going to a club is a good idea. In fact start going before your dog arrives and get to know people and make sure the club is a good fit. Depending on where you live there may be a couple

And PLEASE, read some of these other threads about people that sent their dogs out for training.
True NIGHTMARES, mostly for the dogs.
There are people you can trust your dog with, just please do your homework first.

Thanks for all the comments so far. I will do my research. There is no way I would send my pups nor have my pups around anyone I didn't know or know their reputation. Just won't happen. I was hoping I would get some names of reputable trainers and ballpark costs as well as best ways to imprint a puppy or where to learn other than a club to do that. DVD's? I am just trying to explore all options and will visit our local club prior to the pups getting here. Great ideas. 

Thanks again,

Prodigy

Go to Leerburg's web site and listen to some of the many free streaming videos by Michael Ellis.  You can train obedience which is the foundation for much of any dog sport without any help from any kind of club or trainer.  If you like Michael Ellis and his style of training get his Leerburg produced DVD on training with food, training with a tug, and preparing your dog for the helper.  Start with the Michael Ellis DVD on training with food and see if you like the results.  No need to spend a lot of money at first as a lot of content on Leerburg is free.   Socialization and conditioning your puppy or dog to strangers and environmental stressors is also discussed on Leerburg's site.  Work with your puppy and get to know their head and their heart so that you know them better than you know yourself.  Personally I would not take a puppy to a club before six months of age as everyone there will offer a lot of advice and at least half of it will be wrong.  If you listen and follow the Michael Ellis methods you will save yourself and your dog a lot of time and grief.  The major investment in training a puppy or dog of any age is time.

troopscott gave you very good advice. Go to clubs without your dog to evaluate the group. Observe if you like the training approach. Do they title dogs is one question to find out. From pup to titles? IPO titles? or beginner stuff like Bh and the T1 or O1 degrees. You should visit a few groups to see training. The other forms of instruction will give you some background information but the great part of sport training is you will meet many helpful and knowledge -able people, and a number who will be neither

We always tell people to come and hang out and get a feel for our group and watch training...we have a big, diverse group when it comes to level of training experience, types of dogs (traditional and non-traditional breeds) and styles of training...from traditional all the way to your purely positive folks.    We also advise them to go look at all the other clubs in the area to make sure they find a good fit for themselves and their dogs.  

Listen to all the Michael Ellis videos that you can and repeat the ones on puppy training until they become boring to watch.  When you get your puppies spend all the time that you can with them.  Don't waste 5 - 8 hours per week or more going to a club if that is time you can't spend with your puppies otherwise.  I start taking my young puppies for walks at a local park or state park as soon as they turn three months for socialization and environmental stimulation.  Socialization and obedience at 3-6 months comes first.  Riding in a crate to a local park is just as good as riding in a car to a club meeting.  A club can be a huge waste of time and money in the beginning of training two puppies and if time and money are a concern don't waste it on going to a club and watching them train their dogs because their dogs will be far ahead of yours and doing obedience routines and most likely primarily protection training.  You need to concentrate all of your time and energy on puppy obedience and socialization with two puppies to train until they are 6 months old or older.  The worst thing you can do is start your puppies in protection too early.  If your puppies have good breeding and good nerves they are not going to miss a thing by waiting until 6-8 months to go to a club and start protection foundation work.  More puppies have been ruined by starting protection work too early than have benefited from two or three months gained by starting at 3 months.  For one thing your puppies will have to go through teething around 4-5 months of age so during this period the benefits of tug work or protection oriented work is much less than the potential harm of injuries and is not worth the two or three months gained.  Michael Ellis discusses this on Leerburg's site and although you can start some basic tug work and prey based work at 3 months that can be done just as well at home and in the time it takes you to go to a club meeting just a couple of times.  While the pups are teething do obedience and socialization work.  You are the only person who is going to train your puppies unless you hire a trainer which I do not recommend.  It takes time, patience. and commitment to train one puppy and twice as much to train two.  Puppies have a very short attention span and a young puppy will get more from four 15 minute training sessions per day than a two hour session all at once.  Link below to the beginning video about food treats .. really a great place to start with puppies.

http://leerburg.com/training-with-food.htm

What the hey, go visit a club or 3, no man is an island. You will see the GSD world is more complicated than a video can ever deliver. One [ of many] benefits of sport dog training is you can not do it all yourself. I have learned so much from so many that I might do a video about it.