Teaching the bark & hold - Page 1

I've searched on here & there isn't much mentioned on teaching the bark & hold....so I'm hoping to start a reasonable disscussion on this subject.
How do you(your club, trainer, ect) teach the bark & hold? Does your method differ depending on if its a puppy vs an adult dog or a "problem" dog?

I would say it most definitely depends on the dog....some dogs are barkers and others aren't...suspicion seems to work on most dogs to some degree...

Judron,
Yes I realize training methods would/should depend on the individual dog. What I'm looking for is a disscussion on the various methods being used to teach the bark & hold. So please go ahead & tell us how you teach it :)

well...with my dogs, I started with suspicion at a distance. I started this as a pup...teaching them to alert. I always make the dog start the action...as opposed to a helper running around like a clown to get a response...then I go to a pole so I can concentrate on the dog and not the leash handling...bringing in plenty of distractions....then into the blind after many repititions on the pole...

While the discussion is new, there are thoughts about inadvertently teaching the dog to stay too far away from the decoy and thoughts that an active/harassing bark and hold that controls the helper/decoy is either genetic, desirable, or a liability that loses points if there is a forced movement by the decoy the judge fails to see.  I have also heard that the bark and hold should be a very controlled guard as opposed to an active control by the dog who is trying to make the decoy move to get a bite.  When mentioning training for bark and hold can folks be so kind as to also mention these things and pitfalls.  Thanks!

Hunger4justice.... Good points to discuss... Also if anyone has video of training the b&h, would you be so kind as to share it with us. While I'm very capable of learning & understanding written direction, seeing the method being discussed in action greatly helps put it all together.

I would say the biggest mistake in teaching the H & B is to ever allow the dog to get dirty.  The handler always has to be ready to correct and have the necessary tools available.  Whether is a long line, prong collar, harness, etc.  Working on a post is the best way.  The dog must never be allowed to get dirty, never ever never.  If that is done properly things go a lot smoother down the road. 

Jim

well i am no professional by anymeans...

but our club TD said one of the easiest ways (depending on the dogs drive) to teach the bark and hold is on a poll. get them going in prey by throwing or playing with their tug and get them to bark..reward. soon the dog learns "Ok, i bark, i get a bite..easy"
then you start building on that and slowly adding some OB work with it. dog barks barks barks "SITZ" dog stops barking and sits his but on the ground. no reward given unless it is a quiet sit. then when they have the sitz, platz, bark commands down you can start getting in closer.  That's where I'm at in our training so far.
Here is a video from today.  he struggles to stop barking some days (like today) but he's starting to learn to contain it. and today was the first day we started to move in closer with the tug. he got a bit confused and then the last bite he got he really started to understand what I was asking of him. so we left if on that.

I'm sure there are TONS of other ways to teach it..but it seems like this works well for my pup.
the last 45 seconds is the only part really worth watching. a light flicks on in his head..pretty cool when they do that!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jhknlft1_jk 

again i'm learning..i'm open for critique




 

Control doesn't kill drive if done properly and at the right stage. Like in all aspects of protection. What do you do in obedience? Is your dog all over you all the time? Maybe at first, just like protection. Does the dog not understand that it heels for a bit, or downs, sits, etc and it gets what it wants? Do you not teach your dog to drive you for the reward in obedience? Besides points, what does the dog lose by touching, mouthing, etc the helper? Teach to bark, teach to move the helper with the bark, then move into the hold, which takes control. Loose line=bite.

It seems there are some handlers that start teaching the b&h themselves. What would be the reasoning behind this? For myself, I wouldn't want my dog thinking barking at me gets him a reward...jmo