why does my dog not like being cradled when on the sleeve? - Page 1

My dog loves the protection work especially the fight but when you go to cradle her she gets real chewy and spits it out right away. Is this bad, I think it's because she likes the actual fight and tugging with the helper more than holding the sleeve in her mouth. She is fine when the sleeve is on the helper but the helper slips the sleeve she'll carry it around fine and everything but then when you go in for the cradle she just drops it. She is turning 2 years old this month and I was wondering if she will grow out of this as she becomes more comfortable with the sleeve or will we have to just keep working with her on this? Any comments and suggestions are welcome.

So...if cradling her makes her become mouthy...why do you continue to do it?

You (handler) have desired behavior than you (handler) do something to mess it up and than you (handler) ask what's wrong with the dog:-)

To me there is a conflict there. Your dog probably thinks that everytime you approach, her reward goes away. I start this work with their balls and tugs. I get them to carry just like with the sleeve on the line. I call the dog into me, not a front, but to cradle and sooth. Randomly I do things differently. One time I'll cradle and pet the dog and then it runs with it. The next I'll call the dog into me and we'll play tug. Then an occasional out.

Some dogs don't unload into a sleeve like others do.  I have one dog I could cradle for 10 minutes and another that I cannot craddle at all (and I can craddle him with balls and toys until the sun goes down but that prey/play does not transfer over into actual protection work).  The dog who won't be craddled is not sleeve oriented and works in defense.  Knowing this, it's important for us to make sure he knows he "won", so when the helper slips the sleeve I lead him a farther distance away than other dogs might want to go (or have the helper move away and act neutral).  If the helper is still in his space, he spits instantly and shows aggression right away.  To me this is not a bad thing except that I don't want the dog constantly stimulated.  To him, protection work means that he channels aggression into biting the sleeve and this diffuses the threat.  In order for him to have that "win", the "threat" needs to back off for a few seconds so the dog can unload even if he's not holding a sleeve and being craddled.

VKGSD, I guess I read it differently. I didn't think the dog was spitting it out to re-attack. I thought it read that the dog carried well, but when the handler attempted to cradle, the dog got chewy.

I think my dog assumes if I drop the sleeve I get another bite. Maybe won't attempt to cradle during protection anymore

Chaz, I've seen what you're saying, and you're probably right, I just wanted to make a point that some dogs will never hold and be craddled and it's not always handler conflict.  But I have seen a dog that will carry and hold and as soon as the handler moves in, dog starts chewing and vocalizing.  In that dog's case there is conflict with the handler and overall in how the dog has been worked.

What is the helper doing when you try to craddle the dog?  If the dog is on the sleeve (rather than it being slipped and carried first), can you come up, craddle the dog, and then have the helper slip slowly and back away?  I've seen this work with a few dogs who get too hectic if the sleeve is slipped and carried first.

OK !    Any idea's here ............... I will throw this out for my dog as shown in the pic to the right. The dog is calm on the bite NOT CHEWY and outs very fast ............. fights for the sleeve and presents a very nice picture on the trial field on trial day. ALTHOUGH in training when he is slipped the sleeve he will trot for a few moments and begin to thrash the hell out of the sleeve ..... this is even when I have the helper kneel down with his back to the dog. I can cradle him with the tug and the ball no issue here ..... I tell him to "out" the ball or tug and he was taught to stare at it unless I regain possession of that item OR unless I flip it with my figers as I pick it up so he knows I do not always take possession of it ...... He is a Sch 2 with a 95 pt protection ...... any ideas ... ???  Regards ..... Greg

OH YES !  forgot to mention in the above message ...... cannot cradle him he wants to thrash the sleeve ................... Greg

My young dog and I have what sounds like a very similar situation. I don't try to cradle him anymore. Used to, and it just led to more craziness. I take him down the field, away from the helper. Then I let him circle and carry as much as he wants. May be a step, may be a minute. The second he starts chewing, I out him (at least that is the plan.... hard to make it happen sometimes as I am learning to).

Last week I did not even have to go a long way away from the helper... just far enough that the dog is not still wanting to fight. You may ask the helper to turn sideways or avert his eyes.

I have found that if I platz him, he outs naturally, and then I don't get involved and create more conflict.
---Mary