Grip and nerves. - Page 2

Thanks Power. This problem must be looked at in pieces. The smaller you can make the exercise the easier the fix. The dog is unclear in the defence so work it in isolation from the other work. Not to different from Obedience and tracking problems.

RC, it;s good to "see" you!

Emily,

She is too young to be pushed into defense and needs to be worked totally in prey until she is calm and comfortable with the decoy.  If she is already on the defensive side all the more reason to work her in prey.  I would take the decoy out of the equation by attaching the tug to a long line and tossing it to her.  When she grabs it (after a few misses) both you and the decoy pull.  You can work your way up the leash, keeping constant tension and praise her.  However, she only gets praised when she is calm and not growling or being defensive.  Then the helper can release his tension and you hold the dog with the tug in it's mouth, all the time being calm and offering calm praise.  The next step is to reverse this and the decoy with a bladed body and no eye contact works his way down his line and begins to calmly pet your dog while it is biting the tug.  This takes time, and you must keep your line tight so the dog doesn't drop the tug and bite the decoy.  If I was decoying I would build the dogs confidence up, in this case, so I could approach the dog and calmly praise her myself. 

Remember, full grips have a large genetic component with them.  If she is slightly insecure or unsure she may grip hard but may never be completely full.  Most dogs that bite full and hard are genetically pre-wired for that.  With that said good training can enhance the dogs grips.  Just as poor training, handling and an unskilled decoy can ruin even the best bred dog.

Your dog needs to learn this is a fun game that she can win.  When she becomes comfortable her grips will improve.   Slow down and take your time with her.  Go back to working her like a puppy or a young dog that she is.  I like a serious dog in the bitework, but it has to have a calm, full grip for me. 

I agree with the other suggestions, especially Vickies about presentation and winning the sleeve.  Remember a good foundation in bite work lasts the dog a lifetime.  Correcting this now will make future training much easier. 

Jim

First off its not a grip it is a bite. Second try her behind a fence, this can make the dog feel more safe and secure while still keeping the agression.

In your opinion, what's the dif between a grip and  a bite?

In my above post , the Pup is far too young to be pushed at her age,

If she is not ready for the sleeve then take her back to a Tug and ALWAYS on a Line, even with the sleeve at this age the only time the Pup leaves the line over here is at the end of a lesson when it can have a short run at the Sleeve or Tug and carry the item back to the car

As my Old Karate Master used to drum into me. 'Those ikn haste go nowhere'

Let the Pup take as long as it needs not all Pups take to the Protection right away,

I know a famous Dog over here to World Championship level did not take to the sleeve or protection until it was 3 years old they all of a sudden it went to town and came on as if he had been doing it for years

Not saying your pup is like that, just to show they do not all go the way we want right away

Young Goran 13 months Old had little interest and was on a sack until only last month now on a Tug and learning fast ;But only because he finally caught on and matured a bit,

that is the key maturity, go steady and do not worry about it, it will come on in her own time push her too fast now and you will ruin her and she will lose confidence,

As the great  trainer, Judge and Helper, Rinus Bastiaansen says to me, there is no time limit on when a Dog should go for titiles, they willtell you when they are readyand who knows better than he does

sorry for such a long reply

Steve

Like this...

This show line female is now 20 mos. old, showed only 100% anxious defence, unsureness and hair up when we started her at 15.5 mos. She brought almost NO PREY, wanted no part of the tug, just a piece of the helper... specifically his LEGS :-(   We worked hard to channel her into prey this way, our very smart helper gradually working up the line to introduce close contact and build confidnece. She is now solid on the intermediate sleeve, grips nearly full, hard, carries and circles round back to the helper for another go, prancing happily with good confience, no more sideways glances at his legs.

Teaching to Re-grip in close

This process took some patience, but is really paying off now after a bout 4 mos. We are blessed to have a helper who read the little gals mind, recognised she needed to start back a few steps to learn to channel betwen prey and defence drives and back, and so designed her a program to make it all come together for her, happy and confident in the work instead of too early challenged and fearful & anxious.

One month later:

Be patient. Think and discuss before and after each session. Do correct work that suit your dog's abilities, temperament, and stage of maturity... Don't rush. We think this little minx will do just fine getting her titles in future. It takes a club to traina dog... sure glad we have such a fine group here. Many pleaces she might have gone they have ruined her the first day with never a backwards glance. THIS is Dog training! :-D

SS

In a nut shell, it sounds to me like she has been pushed too hard too young. You  need to back off like those above are saying and make it more of a game until she relaxes and gains her confindance. That's probably why they sold her. She has a very nice pedigree to back her up! It will most likely just take some time and FUN to bring her around.

Debby

RUN FAST ~ BITE HARD ~ PRANCE PRETTY

IME: The game part generally lasts till about two years. Then we make it more serious as the do matures and TELLS US when its time to move on.

SS

Shelley, excellent pictures.  Exactly what I was talking about. 

I don't reccomend the fence work for an already defensive young dog.  This dog should be worked in prey with a tug.  See the photos above.  You don't want to maintain the aggression with this dog (at this point) but to reassure it and build confidence. Although the fence idea is good for some dogs, especially ones you want to build in defense, not ones already loaded in too much defense.   The fence is used to build defense drive, giving the dog security behind the fence enabling it to handle increasing amounts of pressure from the decoy.  This dog needs prey, reward and praise both from the handler and the decoy.

Spencer,  the only difference between a grip and a bite is semantics.  They can be used intechangeably.  As you notice, Shelley also uses grip to describe the bite.  It is common to use the term grip in bitework, we understand the dog is biting. 

Jim