Why Breed Dogs? - Page 3

Gustav, I can't speak to why other agencies are no longer looking to the GSD for their primary dogs, but I can speak to the use of GSDs in the guide dog world. I am visually impaired, would qualify for a guide dog if I chose to apply for one, and am saddened by the switch of most guide dog schools from the GSD (the original absolute breed of choice) to mostly Labs and Retrievers. The GSD was chosen originally for its rock solid nerve, environmental soundness, ability to think clear headedly, ease of training, dedication to its handler, health, and willingness to work under any and all conditions. The complaint now is the many health issues that have popped up, the swing from one extreme to another--either too timid or too aggressive--and an overall general impression that the GSD is, or can be, more of a liability than the asset it is meant to be to its blind handler. There are still a few schools that are utilizing GSDs, at least one of which's foundation sire was an SCHH 3 dog, and they all have their own breeding programs in order to try to minimize the flaws that could creep in. If I ever do find myself in a position of needing a guide dog, I will absolutely go to only one of these schools. I am not a fan of the Lab or Retriever, of any kind, and would not have one as my guide.

That's a bit demeaning to labs, a good dog is a good dog is a good dog.

If you are blind and a dog helps you see I would not get too precious over what breed it is, I would just give it steak and pet it much.....geez.

FWIW.

I was chatting with someone who had a GS guide dog. She was at our Ski Club picnic a few summers ago. And, yes, she did ski. ;D

She commented that many of the blind considered the GS the 'Cadillac' of the guide dogs. The reasons gsdkiera provided were noted. However she also mentioned that another reason was their gait was much smoother and easier to walk with.

Met another guide-dog user while on one of my daily walks. He had a Golden Retriever. He also commented that he wished he could have a Shepherd.

That's why the Guide Dogs Association in the UK continues to produce
a few GSDs and GSD crosses; depending on how tall the partner is and
their walking pace, many people opt for a GSD instead of one of the Labs
or LabxGR mixes. If my sight was damaged enough to qualify me for a
dog, I too would choose a GSD, not just because I'm tall for a female, but
also because I "get" the nature of GSDs - having spent so many years with
them - rather than the Retrieving breeds or others.
We also have a newer organisation here called Pathfinders which trains
ONLY GSDs as Guides (Seeing Eye).

FWIW: I'm a little old fashioned in that I believe that when you breed for hips, DM and other genetic items you lose sight of the fact that it is an animal and it will have imperfections. It is better to breed for the whole dog ( temperament, conformation, longevity, in that order) than to aim at a handful of genetic markers. Many of the breed's best champions would never have been bred today.

Second that. Good post.

Good post, charlie319 !

I tend to think different - a dog with HD/ED may be useless for work and sport, the best temperament won´t help.
The German Shepherd dog is a breed with a very high population, there is no shortage of healthy dogs with good temperament.
As long as I am able to find several good working, healthy dogs right around the corner there is no reason to lower once´s sights in case of breeding.
I don´t like phrases like " my dog may not have the best hips, but he is a good working dog, worth to be bred".
There are still thousands of healthy good working dogs out there...
Raising, training, titling, showing a dog is time consuming and expensive - but honestly, shit happens every day.

Sorry, Susie, we are not talking about dysplastic dogs that cannot walk or do other normal things. We are talking about dogs with a less than Excellent score, but have a tremendous amount of other mitigating factors in their favor, that are simply not present in the others who've scored an "Excellent". "Temperament" includes a number of parameters, including trainability, biddability, hardness, pain-tolerance, fundamental and secondary drives etc., and all dogs are definitely not created equal.

There are theories that state that certain highly desirable temperamental traits for working, did come paired in dogs that had "good" or "fair" hips, and due to the short-sighted focus on "excellent hips", the GSD genepool has significantly shrunk, when those dogs were eliminated from contributing to the future of the breed.

HD/ED is just an example of trait-breeding. There are other aspects also that people seem to be trait breeding for, with a single-minded focus, losing sight of the big picture of breeding dogs. I bet the GSD genepool has shrunk a ton over the past decades, because of the single-minded focus on breeding for traits.

Essentially, focusing on the trees than on the Forest !

"Sorry, Susie, we are not talking about dysplastic dogs that cannot walk or do other normal things. We are talking about dogs with a less than Excellent score, ..."
That sounds different, I don´t have problems with A2 hips.´in case I like everything else ( and there are no dysplastic siblings ).

"There are theories that state that certain highly desirable temperamental traits for working, did come paired in dogs that had "good" or "fair" hips, ..."
I´d need scientific proof to believe that statement.

"There are other aspects also that people seem to be trait breeding for, with a single-minded focus, losing sight of the big picture of breeding dogs."
That´s so true...

Conformation only
Working ability only
Health only
"Cute dog" only...

What I don´t like are breeders who try to tell me that none of their personal dogs are affected by HD/ED/bloat/anything else - but I am not able to see any dogs older than 6 years old in their kennel.... The younger ones often don´t show the signs.

Just my opinion