Health ? Idiopathic Renal Hematuria (after e.coli) - Page 2

You HAVE to have the sensitivity study done.  You have to find what will kill the E. Coli that keeps reappearing.  Probiotics are beneficial bacteria for the gut (small/large intestine).  This is in the urinary tract.  If the pup could have cleared this on his own he would have already(which does happen).  Yes you can have damage to kidneys from UTI, a color change is the first sign on an ultrasound.  Color is often density.  The blood work may/may not show this damage until it is significant.

Been down this road before with one of my kids.  Had kidney damage from doctors F'en it all up.  Caught early enough a kidney will repair itself over time.  Have to clear the infection which means finding out what it is sensitive to. 

The compound you are referring to is for a dog with Renal (kidney) failure.  It helps support the function of the kidneys but won't cure the problem.  This pup is at risk of kidney damage until the infection is cleared.  Get the test done to find out what antibiotic will work on the infection.  Both meds mentioned are penicillan based, they may need something else but it is all guesswork until you have the test done to find out what will kill the e. coli.

Good luck to your friend.  I wouldn't mess around on this.  I know from experience.

What Mk said, and what I said!!  C&S is medical shorthand for culture and sensitivity. And don't muck around: this is SERIOUS!

Jen;  YOU mentioned they did culture of urine but did they do a sensitivity at the same time:  if not they need to proceed ahead with sensitivity;  sounds like current treatment is not touching and definitely curing the problem.  GNC makes a really, really good probiotic with cranberry;  comes in rusty colored box in blister pack;  it is excellent.  I found it not only on-line at GNC but some Rite Aides carry it also. 

The only thing that helps my UTI's (cronic, thank you very much) is Macrobid;  Nitrofuroton, also known by other generic names and I take a maintenance dose of one 100mg capsule every other night after initial cleanup of one capsule 2 times per day (100 mg) for 3-5 days;  then one capsule every other night for maintenance.  ONLY thing that has helped me personally.  Yogart doesn't even touch problems like this but probiotics can and do help. 

Poor little guy and probably will have to wait until all this is much better to find out if any permanent damage has been done.  currently is really a waste of time and money with current results to find out what if any damage has been done;  and really probably will manifest itself if there has been damage done.

By the way my first GSD boy was put on Keflex by the vet when he came to me at 9 l/2 weeks and had a severe reaction to Keflex;  his litter sister had also bad reaction to Albon,  both sulphur drugs;  lost a sammie boy to sulfphr drug treatment by vet for kennel cough (di-trim AKA tribriserin (SP??) also a cattle drug?  (hello)...

So maybe buttermilk added to his food also along with probiotics 2 times per day would help.  Best of luck and can you keep us updated.  Thank you   Nan

Also, if this boy is going to have kidney issues RAW diet is NOT the best for him.  Maybe some of the formulas that Honest Kitchen makes might work but kidney dogs don't process raw correctly.  and be very careful giving him any kind of treats that come from China.  I had to learn that the hard way on my older Sammie boy that died of kidney failure and really do not know when his problem started but was diagnosed at 10 years of age to my surprise and died a couple of years later but I had to really fight for this guy's even partially good health.  Really NOT a fun problem, yet as you probably know very common in many breeds.

Good luck  Nan 

To clarify one thing to MK's post- I know what Renal Support is for, I just suggested it because there seems to be a gray area as to whether they think his kidneys are damaged/being damaged or not. I know w/my last dog w/CRF (from e.coli, nonetheless!!!) that it was a HUGE support to his kidneys and seemed to make a difference in his entire urinary system as well. Maybe not, but it sure seemed like it and we got 3 years, happy years, out of a dog they said couldn't last a week w/those numbers. My reason was as somewhat of a safeguard/extra layer of protection/support, NOT to "cure" this. I am definitely pushing for another route and not at all satisfied with what's been done! 

I was very frustrated with the answer that his kidneys must be doing ok b/c his bloodwork is ok and repeatedly reiterated that kidneys are far too significanly damaged by the time bloodwork will show it. I suggested that albon should maybe be replaced with Toltrazuril (for coccidia), which I offered to give him, and the vet said he'd never heard of it. I HATE having a pup on extended antibiotics. Toltrazuril would kill it, or we can do 2-3 weeks on albon....then amoxy, then ceph, then who knows what, all the while this puppy's organs MUST be being damaged by this e.coli that is not going away!!! Can you tell I'm angry?!

Also, I know probiotics won't cure a UTI. I was trying to get him on good probiotics BEFORE any of this happened, back when he was being treated (along with littermates) for coccidia. Probiotics CAN help prevent problems, especially problems that crop up in terms of weakness and stress, and I would never switch a puppy who'd been on abx to a raw diet without them! I told them to wait a few weeks after starting on a really good probiotic BEFORE going to raw. He started it right away, while the dog's immune system was suppressed due to abx therapy, stress of a new home, total new diet, coccidia (though he was never symptomatic), etc. Ugh. But there's nothing I can do about that now. Now we just need to try and get this poor pup back to normal and not accept this b.s. "idiopathic" diagnosis while his kidneys are being slowly trashed. 

I am waiting to get answers on what exactly has been done as far as sensitivity. I'm afraid they are going for the easier but more expensive tests since this pup has insurance. One vet asked them "does he have insurance or not?" Kind of makes you wonder what the priority is, given the circumstances. 

Jen,

Didn't know what you knew.  Glad to hear we're all on the same page. 

I had to go outside of the health insurance system and pay for a specialist at the University Hospital out of pocket for my kid to be seen.  Once the specialist made his diag, the insurance jumped all over itself to get back in.  It took several years for the kidney to repair itself.  We intitially weren't sure it would and even now 15 years later she is always at higher risk for getting a UTI. 

If they won't fight for their dogs health, the insurance company sure won't either. 

Jen:  how old is this puppy?  Just curious.  Nan

Because panacur will fight coccidia also along with other stuff (worms) giardia etc and seems to be much easier on the dogs than all albon/flagal, etc.  ?? 

First sentence, Nan. 4.5 months.

OH, okay, he's old enough I would panacur him, not as hard on the kidneys as other stuff and may help clean things up.  (that is nasty bacterial stuff also).  BOL  Nan

Why panacur for UTI??