Reply to Shtal (Interesting facts, for believers) - Page 32

Hell of a God that would want to end everything, a nice loving God that nurtures and cares for people and doesn't let children suffer. He/she must be one callous God.

I was going to try to explain what about the 7 days, but I think this explains it a little more clearly than what I had typed out.....

‘But do not forget this one thing, dear friends: With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day. The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.’

The first thing to note that the context has nothing to do with the days of creation. Also, it is not defining a day because it doesn’t say ‘a day is a thousand years’. The correct understanding is derived from the context—the Apostle Peter’s readers should not lose heart because God seems slow at fulfilling His promises because He is patient, and also because He is not bound by time as we are.

The text says ‘one day is like [or as] a thousand years’—the word ‘like’ (or ‘as’) shows that it is a figure of speech, called a simile, to teach that God is outside of time (because He is the Creator of time itself). In fact, the figure of speech is so effective in its intended aim precisely because the day is literal and contrasts so vividly with 1000 years—to the eternal Creator of time, a short period of time and a long period of time may as well be the same.

The fact that the passage is actually contrasting a short and long period can be shown by the fact that Peter is quoting Psalm 90:4 (Peter’s statement ‘do not forget’ implies that his readers were expected to recall something, and this passage has this very teaching). This reads:

‘For a thousand years in your sight are like a day that has just gone by, or like a watch in the night.’

This is synonymous parallelism, where a long period of a thousand years is contrasted with two short periods: a day, and a night watch. But those who try to use this verse to teach that the days of Genesis might be 1000 years long forget the additional part in bold. For if they were consistent, they would have to say that a watch in the night here also means 1000 years. It’s difficult to imagine that a Psalmist (Psalm 63:6) is thinking on his bed for thousands of years or that his eyes stay open for thousands of years (Psalm 119:148).

The immediate context of the Psalm is the frailty of mere mortal man in comparison to God. This verse amplifies the teaching, saying that no matter how long a time interval is from man’s time-bound perspective, it’s like a twinkling of an eye from God’s eternal perspective.

In any case, the meaning of ‘day’ in Genesis 1 is defined by the context there—the Hebrew word for day,yôm יום , is used with the words ‘evening’ and ‘morning’, and the days are numbered (first day, second day, etc.). Whenever yôm is used in such a context, it is always an ordinary day, never a long period of time. The meaning of the days of creation as ordinary days is also affirmed by Exodus 20:8–11, where God told the Israelites to work for six days and rest on the seventh because God had made all things in six days and rested on the seventh. For more information, see other articles in Q&A: Genesis under ‘Days of Creation’.

GSD Admin......Here is what a friend of mine wrote.  Feel free to read it, as well as the others I may post regarding natural distasters, why God lets bad things happen to people, etc. 

“Pat Robertson, the evangelical Christian who once suggested God was punishing Americans with Hurricane Katrina, says a ‘pact to the devil’ brought on the devastating earthquake in Haiti.
 
Officials fear more than 100,000 people have died as a result of Tuesday's 7.0-magnitude earthquake in Haiti.
 
Robertson, the host of the ‘700 Club,’ blamed the tragedy on something that ‘happened a long time ago in Haiti, and people might not want to talk about it.’
 
The Haitians ‘were under the heel of the French. You know, Napoleon III and whatever,’ Robertson said on his broadcast Wednesday. ‘And they got together and swore a pact to the devil. They said, “We will serve you if you will get us free from the French.” True story. And so, the devil said, “OK, it's a deal.”’
 
Native Haitians defeated French colonists in 1804 and declared independence.
 
‘You know, the Haitians revolted and got themselves free. But ever since, they have been cursed by one thing after the other’” (“Pat Robertson says Haiti paying for ‘pact to the devil’”, CNN.com, January 13, 2010).
           
            In light of the vast destruction and loss of human life in disasters such as the earthquake in Haiti, Hurricane Katrina, or the Tsunami in Asia in 2004, many have come to believe that God does not exist. After all, what kind of a “god” would allow such atrocities to take place? Rather than prove that there is no God, though, the tsunami, hurricanes, and earthquakes only disprove the existence of the kind of God we sometimes invent for ourselves. “Well, the God I believe in never punishes anybody,” some say, claiming that their “god” gives them the freedom to live how they want without being judgmental. Gene Edward Veith writes, “That kind of God does not exist. The image of a nice deity who looks benignly down from heaven, wanting us all just to have a good time, is wish-fulfillment, a fiction we might make up so we feel better” (World Magazine, January 22, 2005.)
            When we see events like the Haitian earthquake, we often wonder how God could allow such things – how could He just let so many people die, even those who never obeyed the Gospel? And more to the point of what Pat Robertson is saying, can we observe natural disasters and make some kind of conclusion about them in God’s divine plan? Was Hurricane Katrina America’s punishment for its sins? Was Haiti annihilated because of an act of voodoo two hundred years ago? What we must remember is that God does not necessarily cause natural disasters to happen. This event may not be the Lord’s secret weapon against the evils of this world. It may be, as Ecclesiastes 9:11 puts it, time and chance catching thousands of people off guard. Disasters happen, planes crash, the weather turns foul, and everybody dies, so to say that it is God at work in the Asian tsunami is to assume too much. 225,000 people died as a result of it, which makes it a terrible tragedy. But we all must die at some point. In the end, the death rate for humanity is 100 percent. Nobody knows how or when or where, but we all have the opportunity to prepare ourselves for it now. Let us spend some time considering the fundamental issues when it comes to God’s role in natural disasters.
 
Act Of God?
 
            One writer sees an irony in the common attitude toward disasters. “It is distressing that natural disasters are often termed “acts of God” while no “credit” is given to God for years, decades, or even centuries of peaceful weather. God created the whole universe and the laws of nature (Genesis 1:1). Most natural disasters are a result of these laws at work. Hurricanes, typhoons, and tornados are the results of divergent weather patterns colliding. Earthquakes are the result of the earth’s plate structure shifting. A tsunami is caused by an underwater earthquake” (Disappointment With God, Philip Yancey). If we blame God for earthquakes, why are we so slow to give God credit for pleasant, sunny days, or good crops, or any other naturally occurring blessing?
            In the same way that God allows us to practice our free will, this planet is allowed by its Creator to function in a somewhat fluid manner. It was corrupted by sin, death, and decay, and is subject to disastrous consequences. “For the anxious longing of the creation waits eagerly for the revealing of the sons of God. For the creation was subjected to futility, not of its own will… For we know that the whole creation groans and suffers the pains of childbirth together until now” (Romans 8:19-22). Death and decay are natural consequences of a world subjected to corruption by sin. By design, this planet will not live forever (2 Peter 3:10-11).
            It seems to make more sense that natural disasters are not “acts of God” – in the sense that God immediately and purposefully causes them – but acts of nature by design. Jesus Himself warns us about reading into disasters too much, stating that they are actually normal. “And you will hear of wars and rumors of wars; see that you are not frightened, for those things must take place, but that is not yet the end… and in various places there will be famines and earthquakes. But all these things are merely the beginning of birth pangs” (Matthew 24:6-8). If we observe war, famine, and natural disaster, that is simply a sign that everything is operating normally in this world, not a sign that God is somehow intervening in our affairs.
 
Natural Disasters And A Benevolent God
 
            God created a world ruled by natural laws established at the creation. For example, if a person steps off the roof of a building, gravity will pull him to the pavement beneath. If one steps in front of a moving train, he will likely be killed because two objects cannot occupy the same space. The same laws that govern gravity and motion also govern meteorology, hydrology, and geology. All of nature is regulated by these laws, not just the parts we find convenient or comforting.
            Second, some disasters may be the by-product of something that itself is beneficial to our survival or enjoyment. “In a physical world where there is water for boating and swimming, some will drown. If there are mountains to climb, there must also be valleys into which one may fall. If there are cars to drive, collisions can also occur. It may be said that tornadoes, lightning, hurricanes, and other natural disasters are likewise by-products of a good physical world. For instance, the purpose of rain is not to flood or drown, but the result of rain may include these disasters. Likewise, hot and cold air are an essential and purposeful part of the physical world, but under certain conditions they may combine to form tornadoes” (The Roots Of Evil, Norman Geisler, p. 72). The natural laws that God created to allow us to produce fire and harness it also allow us to destroy forests. Laws that make it possible to have things constructive to human life also introduce the possibility that things destructive to human life may occur. How can it be otherwise? It would actually show a great lack of benevolence on God’s part to deny us natural blessings like fire, wind, rain, and geothermal energy.
            God’s benevolence demands equal access by all people to both the bad and the good phenomena of this planet, “for He causes His sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous” (Matthew 5:45). “Is it not from the mouth of the Most High that both good and ill go forth?” (Lamentations 3:38).
 
Selective Intervention
 
            Natural laws are both inviolate and non-selective. Everyone must obey them or suffer the consequences, without regard to one’s moral status. Jesus teaches in Luke 13:2-5 that death and destruction show no preference, and that people die from natural laws whether they are sinful or not. “Or do you suppose that those eighteen on whom the tower of Siloam fell and killed them, were worse culprits than all the men who live in Jerusalem? I tell you, no…” Gravity worked equally on the righteous and unrighteous when that tower fell over. Natural laws, therefore, work continually and consistently so that we can understand and benefit from them.
            But why would a loving God not intervene in something like an earthquake or tsunami? “Thus, in a world which operates according to divine miraculous intervention, there would be no necessary relation between phenomena, and in particular between cause and effect. In some instances one event would follow from a certain set of conditions, another time a different event, and so on, such that ultimately an uncountable variety of events would follow a given set of conditions. There would be no regularity of consequence, no natural production of effects.... Hence, we could not know or even suppose what course of action to take to accomplish a certain rationally conceived goal. Thus, we could neither propose action nor act ourselves” (“Natural Evils and Natural Laws”, International Philosophical Quarterly, Vol. 16, 1976, Bruce Reichenbach, p. 187). The Lord affirms our ability to predict (with some reliability) natural events based on observable conditions in Matthew 16:2-3. But if God intervened at every moment wherein a human being was in danger, we would never know how to respond, how to predict, how to react, or how to prepare. We would be at the whim of a God who sometimes lets nature obey its laws and sometimes does not.
 
The Real Lesson
 
            When tragedies happen, so many folks ask, “Why does God allow this to happen?” The questions that are often neglected, though, are “Why does God allow me to keep on living in light of sins?” or “Why did God sacrifice His son for a sinner like me?” We should not spend our days in idle sin, in dread of death, or in the vanity of the flesh. Instead, we ought to seek God and use our time wisely (Ephesians 5:15-16), for this life is so precious and fragile. Natural disasters remind us that this world is not our home, and that any moment may be our last. They force us to keep perspective, to put others first, and to sacrifice when those around us suffer. Natural disasters give us the opportunity to teach the world that we have a home in heaven. “But as it is they desire a better country, that is a heavenly one” (Hebrews 11:16). “Lay up treasure for yourself in heaven, where moth and rust cannot destroy and where thieves do not break in and steal, for where your treasure is there will your heart be also” (Matthew 6:20-21).

Pat Robertson, lmao.  $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

No God should allow the weakest amongst us to suffer. What about the terminally ill? Why don't he just end it instead of making people suffer? And don't say it is because of a pact with the devil. My great-grandfather suffered tremendously at the end and he was a preacher/minister a very religious man who prayed at the end for God to take him and I believe he lost a lot of faith in the end because he suffered for so long.

Children who are pure are allowed to suffer by this loving God. WTH.

Believe all you want but God is powerless because no sane mind would allow this kind of suffering.

BTW, when you copy and paste material off the net please provide a link to that material.

So many interpretations,  so little time.



BabyEagle,
Now your just being a smartass.

I liked you better when you believed Ron Paul was your savior.

Hey Guy,
your turn, who created your creator?


Moons.

Unbelievable. Why couldn't you people keep that stuff on Shtals thread. Now both threads are full of jargon. This thread isn't about religion - it's about evolution vs "intelligent design" or "creation".

No wonder people despise religious fanatics. I can see why now.

Yes we can blame goudie and shital for these endless exercises in futility..


Same question BabyEagle,
who created your creator, and thus answer the question of evolution V creation.

Moons don't you know that God has a superGod who created him. Or maybe he created himself. Like poof and he was God.

something from nothing?