Freaks now in the UK - Page 9

I see none of you have said anything about the part of my post which says "Never heard the story of the first registered German Shepherd (Horand Von Grafrath) that originally had a white for a Granddaddy (Grief Spar Wasser)ha! ha! no mention of that in your post where all your Black and Tans and ALL other German Shepherds I might add Originated from, was there??" I wonder why that is. At the end of the day breed standard or not ALL OF YOUR GERMAN SHEPHERDS came from the first registered shepherd who had a white grandfather so maybe the whites and the coloured are the ones who really have more right to be here than the black and tans. What gives any of you the right to say what colours people should breed. Any breed of dog has as much right to be in the world regardless of colour just the same as human beings of different colours so who the hell do you all think you are. As I said your dogs came from a white German shepherd pure and simple so you are all hypocrites. Also after looking at some of your dogs I have to say that some of the coloured shepherds with their beautiful coats are far more attractive that your normal bog standard black and tan and at the end of the day it is not for any of you or me to decide what colours are right and what are wrong.

by VomMarischal on 06 May 2010 - 02:05 
I have never kept secret the two livers I got in my last litter. But they have been neutered and pet placed. I would NEVER sell them to a puppy mill like k9pines to perpetuate the problem. Just my opinion that it's a problem, but DUH, why would I post somebody else's opinion....

So VomMarischal, would love to see a link to your website and see what you have choosen to produce.  I am pretty certain your style of GSD would not be my cup of tea so no worries about my wanting a liver from you.  Besides I am quite pleased with the ones I have now. 

The problem as you call it, is a gene that is naturally in the gene pool and causes no problems.  The standard was REWRITTEN for personal preferences, and I personally prefer to work with them.

Melisa Smith www.k9-pines.com
(Who is not afraid to sign their posts, list their phone number on their website, or post their website)

Saratoga, it's a weak argument. The very first foundation bitch of the boxer breed was white, yet the the breed's founder nevertheless worked to breed the white coat out (and I think that was because of the white gene's tendency to take over, and because of well documented health issues such as skin problems and deafness). Nowadays, when people do not like to to think of themselves as prejudiced based on color, white is making a big comeback and threatens to dominate the fawn and brindle boxers. Whites are NOT rare; I had a litter of boxers a jillion years ago that included three fawns and three whites, but I was contractually obliged (by the stud's owner) to humanely dispose of the whites. Can't say I liked it, but I did it.

When von Stephanitz referred to color, saying that no German shepherd is a bad German shepherd just because of color, I do not believe he was talking about genetic faults but about standard colors. The fact that a breed USED to have certain colors, back when the breed was founded, does NOT mean that those colors are approved or sought after. Was von Stephanitz breeding for white or to get white OUT? I really have no idea here; I'm hoping for an answer from someone who has a good grasp of the history. 

One of my problems with off-colored GSDs is not about the GSD at all but about some tendencies of humans to want to be "unique." The uneducated pet buyer wants something "new," something that people don't see every day. So in order to cash in on that desire to be unique, unscrupulous breeders create the "rare" and "valuable" blues, livers, etc. There is no reason to do that except to make a buck by cornering a certain market. These people don't care about standards or showing or health or titling or the future of the breed or anything else; they just want to be different and flashy. And then they want to BREED their fancy livers and blues. This is a nasty slippery slope because it makes color rather than other features MORE important rather than LESS important.

Never mind what Uber thinks; my dogs are bred for sport. My last litter (3.5 years ago) included a bi, two sables, and two livers. The two livers went to pet homes, and the other 3 are all competing in Schutzhund. I just wanted to clear that up before my reputation suffers as a result of an ignorant statement. My current litter of ten, which is exactly twice as many as I ordered, will all be going to Schutzhund homes except for the two I am keeping--I will start them in PSA and see how that goes. These are not pets, rest assured; these are wild and crazy sport dogs. I wish some of them would go to police homes, too...

K9pines, I do not have a website. I am not a professional breeder. I am a hobby breeder. I have never advertised any dog I have ever produced; they all go by word of mouth to homes where they will be trained for competition.

Everybody here knows that my name is Jackie Marshall. Just because YOU don't know it doesn't mean I live in secrecy. 

by bazza on 06 May 2010 - 08:05 bazza
O.M.G I can't believe some of the comments here, have any of you heard of THE GSD BREED STANDARD? I Will send a copy to anyone who wants one.
As for ANY of the dogs on this breeders, I refuse to name it as she has plugged it enough, can anyone point me to one of those.....dogs that conform to the BREED STANDARD??

bazza who ever you are... what country are you from?  I certainly know what the breed standard is and I know that the breed standard was changed in the US (which is where I reside) because of a blue dog winning over other colors. 

Even if you disregard the vast array of colours, there is not one that portrays the standard. Where are all the health test results, hips? elbows? haemo? breed surveys? work titles? show grades? anything? The dog in her avatar, is this what we should be striving for? This is a breed standard animal? This is a working dog?

No, my dogs are not working dogs, they are family companions mostly which is what I breed for.  I have very good success in breeding wonderful family companions.   Feel free to read my guest book on the first page of my website.  In America the dog in my avatar is a nice rep of a medium built GSD, not extreme in one way or another.  He fits the written standard without the extremes seen in the show lines, working lines, german show lines, etc...  If you do not like him that is your choise.  Still waiting to see a link to your website and see your dogs.  

And since I need another plug here is that link again :-)

www.k9-pines.com
There is a whale of a difference from a off colour "popping" up in a breed standard litter to what this breeder is doing, breeding crap to crap and producing crap for the ill informed pet buying puppy market!!!!
BREED STANDARD ANYONE? Nah! stuff that it's easier and more lucrative just to breed crap!!!
PLEASE FEEL FREE TO EDUCATE AND EXPLAIN HOW ANY OF THESE DOGS ARE CORRECT TO THE STANDARD OTHER THAN THE OBVIOUS.... IN CORRECT COLOURS. I'm not interested in your standard, that's obvious, I'm talking about THE standard that is there for a reason.

Like I said bazza lets see your dogs, I am sure you would love to hear my opinion about what you are working with.  I will not judge you as a breeder as that is what you choose to work with. 

How about a dog like this:   He is about 6 months old, a nice blue sable.  Since you do not seem to favor the American show look (which some of mine are) and others are a medium representative of the standard, this boy is more German looking. 











Melisa

I would imagine, K9pines, that you can use all the plugs you can get. 

K9-pines.i,m sorry to say that imo.the dog in your avatar does not conform to the standard.it looks like the alsatian type we have here in the uk.chest too deep,leg length too short,dippy back and the hind angulation appears to be on the extreme side.i do admit that the younger dog appears to be an improvement.yu say yu breed for the pet market,and here is the difference,most breeders who work(title)show their animals tend to only breed when they want another to carry on working or showing.imo.yu breed as a business and not to replace(by that i mean take over not rehome)an older animal.money doesnt come into the equation.a small profit may come our way when one has a litter but most time its a loss.the expenditure with regards to showing over here in the uk is astromonical,but your expenditure would just be the feeding of your pregnate female,the raising of the litter and the AKC reg(if yu do that)maybe puppy jabs.So all in all i see a fair profit for yu in each litter.i actually wouldnt mind owning either a solid blue or liver as i find them mosst attractive BUT NO WAY WOULD I BREED THEM TO EITHER A STANDARD COLOUR  OR NON STANDARD COLOUR.Carole Spelman RHEINMEISTER GSDS.PS.if yu wish to see one of my animals,find the thread LORNAVILLE ALSATIANS on this board and yu,ll see the type i prefer.bear in mind she was only 18 months old in this photo.she has bodied up and is more substantial now,aged 7 and a half.this bitch has won under all types of judges  here in the uk,from german to all rounders.