IPO prospect? - Page 6

My post got lost???
Once again: At least in Germany any FCI / all breed events are second or third choice for SV members, these events are, let´s say, "unimportant". As soon as a dog is qualified for BSP, the "normal" handler doesn´t try to participate in any all breed event, too.
You need to know about the "German mind" - a GS with SV pedigrees normally is handled within SV, not within DVG. Why? SV is a BREED club, not a pure working club. Owners of pedigreed GS tend to become member of SV, owners of Malinois, Mutts, or anything else, tend to become member of DVG.
DVG is interested in all breed events, SV is interested in SV events, pretty normal.
A dog/handler team participating in BOTH events during the same year is more than special and speaks for dog and handler.

FCI IPO is not a DVG event in Germany. It is open to all breed clubs under the VDH which is the FCI member and sends the IPO team to the FCI championships. DVG is not a breed or "breeding" club and does not require that dogs not be neutered to compete in sports all the way to the DVG championship which has nothing to do with SV or any other breed organization under the VDH. The "mutts" and other breeds not members of the once mighty SV such as Mals, Schnauzers, Dutch Shepherds, and Rotties have their own breed clubs that are members of the VDH and can compete in FCI IPO through the VDH. The VDH decides who will represent Germany at the FCI championships not the DVG.

Did you even READ my post? Is my English THAT BAD?

Susie,

I think he does not read much, he just writes a lot of the same thing, like a broken record.
Martina

For Bubba, only for the record:

Übersicht der Mitgliedsorganisationen

Anzeige VDH-Mitgliedsvereine 15 VDH-Landesverbände - regionale Interessensvertretung des VDH

1. 157 Rassehunde-Zuchtvereine - betreuen eine oder mehrere Rassen
2. Deutscher Hundesportverband (dhv) und Deutscher Verband der Gebrauchshundsportvereine (DVG) - befassen sich ausschließlich mit Hundeausbildung und -sport.

http://www.dvg-hundesport.de/home/gebrauchshundsport/weltmeisterschaft~8a8181bf1dfce6f4011dfd170b830105.de.html

Now for those who are interested: SV has the most local clubs in Germany( 2000 ), followed by DVG ( 750 )/DHV ( conclusion of 6 minor clubs ).
The breed clubs like Malinois, Rottweiler, Boxer, Terrier, and so on, only have a few local clubs, and in most of them there is no active IPO group, that said a lot of these dogs are trained in DVG clubs. "Mutts" ( there is nothing to say against mutts, some are outstanding working dogs ) are almost exclusively trained in DVG/DHV, makes sense, they are no "breed".

A German Shepherd ( SV ) who wants to participate in both events ( SV/FCI ) has to go for

BSP ( SV ) through
local trials ( result counts ), mostly in spring
Landesgroup trial ( the best qualify, depends on the members within the Landesgroup ), in summer
BSP in early fall

FCI through
qualification within the Landesgroup ( handled differently within the groups ) in spring
National qualification in early summer
VDH qualification in late summer
FCI championship in early fall

Almost all of it during the same time at totally different locations.

Given that a lot of people reading this didn´t compete at any local IPO trial at least once in their life ( not even talking about Regionals ) it may be difficult for me to explain how time consuming training for only ONE of these events is.

People have to choose, and SV members tend to choose the SV event.

 

 

It could be that the breeding rights, offspring, and close relatives of SV dogs placing high in the BSP are what is "sold" to the GSD breeders worldwide so that the winner of the BSP does not want to go to the FCI and finish #20 behind a dozen Mals and six foreign born GSD from Slovakia and the Czech Republic .. would not be good for business for the BSP winner to be shown inferior to Mals and foreign born dogs at the FCI championship would it??? I think that the SV does not send dogs or maybe they are not qualifying to send dogs to the FCI championship because there is more to lose in money and sales from going and losing than from going and winning which looks increasingly difficult with dogs from other countries and the Mals increasingly moving onto the winners stand. As with most things SV it is politics and money first and foremost. Of course winning or placing well at the FCI, BSP, or BSZS does not make any dog the best for breeding regardless of the high score and silver bowl but many people like to breed to the latest "flavor of the month" dog so the money is too good to pass up.

Bubba, you don´t even know what I am talking about.
Just enjoy your dogs.

Susie - you have "the patience of a saint". LOL

I imagine the BSP is a lot like the USCA Nationals. Only a handful of people have a shot of winning year after year. There might be a little more variation than what we have in the United States just due to the larger amount of participation and therefore the larger chance for new talent to do something, but at the end of the day year after year there are really only 10 or so dogs that have proven themselves through qualification trials, prior performances, and possibly some name recognition that are going to compete for the podium. The rest of the people are going to compete, and if their dog has an exceptionally great day they might podium with the help of a few other dogs having bad days or making a mistake they usually don’t.

Yes…for those that haven’t had national level or even world level aspiration, it is hard to understand the mindset that those people have. To understand those people is the same as understanding the highest level athletes of other sports. They don’t fear losing, they truly believe their dog and their training is superior. Many can be objective and understand that at a certain level and after seeing what another dog/handler team is capable of they will lower their own expectation of a result at a championship, but that just allows them to accept the result emotionally and not be upset for as long.

The assumption that the FCI world championship provides for higher level competition than the WUSV is incorrect. Yes, you can say the competition is higher there than at the BSP only because you’re talking about the top 5 or so dogs from each nation and not just the hundreds of the best dogs from one, but when you see the numbers that are listed about how much larger the sport is in Germany than it is anywhere else, it’s not a stretch to believe the competition might be just as high. Like I stated earlier, both GSD that the United States sent to the FCI this year, failed to qualify for the WUSV (one was the alternate and chose to go to the FCI). You can assume the same thing happens in other countries where IPO has a history of producing world level competitors (those that have a shot at the top 10 or the podium at the world level). So you’re more than likely not getting the true TOP 5 IPO dogs from each country. GSD trainers/handlers are going to choose the WUSV over the FCI. History, tradition, money, who knows? But I will not assume that the FCI, just because malinois and other breeds are included is any higher level competition than the WUSV or even the BSP. There are still more GSD doing the sport and therefore it is statistically just as likely you have just as high level of dogs.

For those interested in the malinois/GSD comparison, this year will be very interesting. The US national competitions are in the same place, and although the judges will be different the conditions will be as close to each other as they have ever been and it will definitely provide for a fairly even comparison.