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by lukemoua on 19 December 2009 - 06:12
thank you all for your answers. it's good to see others peoples perspective on this topic. joining a shutzund club first would be a good start. then i'll decide which road to take after that.
adi, i alreay have a puppy. lol she's nice, but not ppd material...i think. i will definitely keep you posted on our progress.
again thank you all for answers, it really does help.
adi, i alreay have a puppy. lol she's nice, but not ppd material...i think. i will definitely keep you posted on our progress.
again thank you all for answers, it really does help.
by lukemoua on 19 December 2009 - 06:12
oops...i don't know how i double posted. but....
thank you all for your answers. it's good to see others peoples perspective on this topic. joining a shutzund club first would be a good start. then i'll decide which road to take after that.
adi, i alreay have a puppy. lol she's nice, but not ppd material...i think. which is fine also, i don't think i should jump into something a novice isn't ready for. lol i will definitely keep you posted on our progress.
again, thank you all for answers, it really does help.
thank you all for your answers. it's good to see others peoples perspective on this topic. joining a shutzund club first would be a good start. then i'll decide which road to take after that.
adi, i alreay have a puppy. lol she's nice, but not ppd material...i think. which is fine also, i don't think i should jump into something a novice isn't ready for. lol i will definitely keep you posted on our progress.
again, thank you all for answers, it really does help.
by soulehunde on 20 December 2009 - 15:12
Adi,
What kind of neighborhood you live in does not matter if the devil pays a visit to your door as recently happened to a lady and her daughter in Milford N.H. 3 older teenagers decided it would be great fun to pick out a home in the night, break in rob it, and kill who ever was home. They used a machete and killed the mother. The daughter was more fortunate , they only cut her throat and cut off some of her toes.
It does not matter where someone lives bad things can happen anywhere. Layering your personal security is smart not paranoid. An alarm system with a good dog backing it up and a gun with proper training is a good start.
Also a good Read for anyone interested is Gavin DeBecker " The Gift of Fear" You will be much more informed after reading him.
John
What kind of neighborhood you live in does not matter if the devil pays a visit to your door as recently happened to a lady and her daughter in Milford N.H. 3 older teenagers decided it would be great fun to pick out a home in the night, break in rob it, and kill who ever was home. They used a machete and killed the mother. The daughter was more fortunate , they only cut her throat and cut off some of her toes.
It does not matter where someone lives bad things can happen anywhere. Layering your personal security is smart not paranoid. An alarm system with a good dog backing it up and a gun with proper training is a good start.
Also a good Read for anyone interested is Gavin DeBecker " The Gift of Fear" You will be much more informed after reading him.
John
by Adi Ibrahimbegovic on 21 December 2009 - 05:12
Thank you John for the info. Let me cut and paste what I wrote on a thread this summer...
" If somebody wants to rob my home...
The dog goes out no restrictions on him.
While I grab a Glock.
He gets past the dog, the Glock is waiting with 15 9 mm bullets in the magazine, witha few spares waiting just in case..
He gets past the Glock that is empty, a Mossberg 500 Persuader (I assume it got that name so you can "persuade" the other person to see your point of view) shotgun is waiting.
He gets past the Mossberg's 12 gauge 6 shots, then I'll be waiting, calmly and patiently.
He gets past me... My wife SHOULD have something cooking there...He gets past that...
Well, I have to hand it to the fella. Okay, you can have now 32$ that I have in my wallet, you deserve it for the determination. And the coins in the jar, about 20 bucks. I would believe the booty is not worth the effort.
On the street, if the dog is with me, he goes first, then Glock, then bare hands with some martial arts training behind it.
I never had to use any of these things yet and I like it that way, and I hope I never will have to use it.
Body language, common sense, trying not to be at a wrong place at a wrong time and "situational awareness" is all you need 99% of the time."
That seems like an interesting book that you mentioned, I mightgran a copy when I have some spare time.
"
" If somebody wants to rob my home...
The dog goes out no restrictions on him.
While I grab a Glock.
He gets past the dog, the Glock is waiting with 15 9 mm bullets in the magazine, witha few spares waiting just in case..
He gets past the Glock that is empty, a Mossberg 500 Persuader (I assume it got that name so you can "persuade" the other person to see your point of view) shotgun is waiting.
He gets past the Mossberg's 12 gauge 6 shots, then I'll be waiting, calmly and patiently.
He gets past me... My wife SHOULD have something cooking there...He gets past that...
Well, I have to hand it to the fella. Okay, you can have now 32$ that I have in my wallet, you deserve it for the determination. And the coins in the jar, about 20 bucks. I would believe the booty is not worth the effort.
On the street, if the dog is with me, he goes first, then Glock, then bare hands with some martial arts training behind it.
I never had to use any of these things yet and I like it that way, and I hope I never will have to use it.
Body language, common sense, trying not to be at a wrong place at a wrong time and "situational awareness" is all you need 99% of the time."
That seems like an interesting book that you mentioned, I mightgran a copy when I have some spare time.
"
by Slamdunc on 21 December 2009 - 07:12
This is an interesting thread with some good points. I'm jumping in late so I'll just add my 2 cents. A good SchH dog should be able to defend it's owner reasonably well. I know many people that compete on the National level with some very serious dogs. They take their training to another level than most club level SchH people do. They can turn their dogs on and off in a heartbeat and I'm sure these dogs will bite you for real. I prefer a serious dog in SchH, one that bites the sleeve because it's there but would also bite the decoy given the chance. I am not a fan of prey oriented dogs at trials, they just don't look as impressive as the more serious dogs.
PP training is fine when done correctly, but again it's really just a sport. it is similar to PSA and Ring. The only difference is it's not a routine like SchH is. If the dog can see or smell equipment it knows it's training and it can smell equipment from a long distance. So to be effective you need to be creative and use less equipment. I think one of the biggest components to PP training is to stress the handler as much as the dog, then it becomes more realistic for both parties. I think handler stress is really the key to see how well the dog and handler work together. Look at what happens at some SchH trials when the handler becomes nervous, the dog acts completely different.
I agree with ADI and John, the world is changing and becoming more dangerous every day. I think a good security plan starts outside your house with good lighting, then strong deadbolts. 99% of the time a good dog that barks is all you need. Most burglars will find an easier target. If someone is really determined on breaking into your house with bad intentions and knows you have a dog, odds are your dog will be little help against a determined adversary. It is the rare dog that will actually be effective in defending you against an attacker that is not scared and very determined. Most people fool themselves into thinking that their dog will stand fight and not run.
I like Adi's plan, I would do it a little differently though. I have the advantage of being a police officer and a K9 handler. I am a firearms instructor and a defensive tactics instructor. I have been on the entry team for narcotics search warrants over a 100 times and have even been shot at a couple of times. The advantage for me beyond my training is that I know how I'll react under stress, I know how I'll shoot and how I'll fight. I also have two GSD's, my SchH 3 female and my police dog. My female is older, so she's the early warning system. My male won't bark at the door, he'll watch you walk in, but you won't leave. Now this dog has proven himself on the street and I know what he'll do. I've been threatened by some guys that I've put in jail, one went so far as to describe my house. If some moron tries to break in, in the middle of the night I just want my dogs to wake me up and give me a second to adjust my vision and get my wits about me. That is all I want from my dogs, the K9 will do a little more I'm sure, but I'll handle the rest.
My advice to those seeking a PP dog would be to evaluate your needs. First, I would examine your home security from locks to lighting. Then I would evaluate your handling skills and what type of dog that you want, liability is something to seriously consider. Next I would consider a firearm and some very good training. Just like dog training, firearms training is a perishable skill and requires practice
PP training is fine when done correctly, but again it's really just a sport. it is similar to PSA and Ring. The only difference is it's not a routine like SchH is. If the dog can see or smell equipment it knows it's training and it can smell equipment from a long distance. So to be effective you need to be creative and use less equipment. I think one of the biggest components to PP training is to stress the handler as much as the dog, then it becomes more realistic for both parties. I think handler stress is really the key to see how well the dog and handler work together. Look at what happens at some SchH trials when the handler becomes nervous, the dog acts completely different.
I agree with ADI and John, the world is changing and becoming more dangerous every day. I think a good security plan starts outside your house with good lighting, then strong deadbolts. 99% of the time a good dog that barks is all you need. Most burglars will find an easier target. If someone is really determined on breaking into your house with bad intentions and knows you have a dog, odds are your dog will be little help against a determined adversary. It is the rare dog that will actually be effective in defending you against an attacker that is not scared and very determined. Most people fool themselves into thinking that their dog will stand fight and not run.
I like Adi's plan, I would do it a little differently though. I have the advantage of being a police officer and a K9 handler. I am a firearms instructor and a defensive tactics instructor. I have been on the entry team for narcotics search warrants over a 100 times and have even been shot at a couple of times. The advantage for me beyond my training is that I know how I'll react under stress, I know how I'll shoot and how I'll fight. I also have two GSD's, my SchH 3 female and my police dog. My female is older, so she's the early warning system. My male won't bark at the door, he'll watch you walk in, but you won't leave. Now this dog has proven himself on the street and I know what he'll do. I've been threatened by some guys that I've put in jail, one went so far as to describe my house. If some moron tries to break in, in the middle of the night I just want my dogs to wake me up and give me a second to adjust my vision and get my wits about me. That is all I want from my dogs, the K9 will do a little more I'm sure, but I'll handle the rest.
My advice to those seeking a PP dog would be to evaluate your needs. First, I would examine your home security from locks to lighting. Then I would evaluate your handling skills and what type of dog that you want, liability is something to seriously consider. Next I would consider a firearm and some very good training. Just like dog training, firearms training is a perishable skill and requires practice
by Davren on 21 December 2009 - 23:12
This short video gives a taste of pp training and the need to be able to "push the off button" . I apologize in advance, it is not a GSD, but a Mal. but is still neat to watch. My dog goes nuts when we watch these videos! LOL
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SjOgzUdExpU
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