Top names in Handlers, conformation? - Page 5

LOL, beetree, IMO the spicy main character is Evelyn (the Kathy Bates character).

http://www.magic-meadows.com/Male-German-Shepherds.php

Talking about people here, some knowing alot about the German Shepherd and most knowing more than you, is not such a wise venture.  Maybe before you start breeding dogs, you should learn something about them.  Learn how to train them (sending your dog out to be trained by someone else and then complaining about them doesn't count), learn about the different terminologies and what they mean (a rating of "SG" is just that,,,,,a rating of conformation, NOT A TITLE).  You criticize a guy about his training and yet you have pictures of him on your website????  Stop trying to gain knowledge from other people's experience here and go out and LEARN it for yourself,,,,,experience it, experience is the best teacher.  Charging an $800 stud fee for an untitled dog???  Can you say phony?

Windy, may I interject another point of view here that maybe you'll be able to understand? First, let me say, I have had experience with RR as my X2B purchased a puppy from her. I didn't like what I saw on her website, didn't think she knew what she was doing, etc. I had been looking at a reputable breeder, well known here, but my better half (NOT) vetoed my decision and went with RR. There was an issue with the papers because she had not paid for the dam and the co-owner (not previously known to exist) would not sign off on the litter. He never did listen to me.  Point being, just purchasing a dog from her showed that you had a lot to learn.

Second, there are many knowledgeable people on this board that have always given sound advice to any who request it. They are willing and ABLE to assess a situation and give their valuable, VETERAN opinion. Some may not have the patience to persevere when the drama overrides the initial request for help. But, if their advice is followed, 9 times out of 10, you will probably get the result you were after in the beginning.

So, with your particular situation, you came here asking for advice and ended up slamming those who were trying to help. They rightly ended up feeling more sorry for the dog in question when it became a tug-of-war between you and RR. Many suggestions were met with ignorance and out-right arrogance. You seriously didn't seem as concerned for the dog's well-being as much as you were concerned with being "right". I came away thinking that you didn't really come here to request help with your situation as much as you wanted validation for your actions. Then you disappeared...

FF, can't remember how long it was, but, you come back, not to add anything of importance, but to complain once again with yet another drama, right or wrong doesn't matter. Actually, being right would make it worse!  Just the fact that you keep making poor choices would speak volumes about how much you don't know.  And so a pattern developed. Instead of coming here to listen and learn, you came as "I want to breed GSDs and you're all idiots because I'm always right!" You were obviously a newbie on a fast-track, which smacks of caring more about making money breeding. Most people come to know the breed, work the breed, love the breed, before (and if ever) they breed the breed. It doesn't happen overnight and you can't become a reputable breeder JUST because you have titled, health screened, pretty dogs.  What's your ultimate goal?  You build a reputation over many years of acquiring knowledge and working with the dogs. It takes decades to learn what you're trying to cram into months and you're making enemies along the way, the WRONG enemies. Then, instead of tucking your tail and listening to those who could teach you what you're after, you go on a bashing spree, calling these very people trolls!

You have a lot to learn, young lady. and you're going about it the wrong way. If you really care about the dogs and not the dollar, I suggest you check your attitude and ego at the door and request entrance, instead of using a ramrod. An open mind and attitude will take you much further in this dog world. You may be the next generation but you're not listening to those with the experience you hope to gain, so never will. And that is disastrous for this breed.
JMObservation, FWIW.

Phil,
I do NOT have a picture of him on my website!  What?  There is a picture of his helper doing what my dog was trained to do in GERMANY not by him. 
800.00 base price, if you would look farther, the price is DRASTICALLY REDUCED TO "qualified" (my interpretation) bitches. 
See this is my big problem.  People look up some information then form these HUGE and WRONG opinions.  Which they could have avoided if they would have dug a little deeper.

GSD,
Point well taken.  Might I ad that at no time on this board have I claimed to know it all or not be willing to learn.  Truth be told I have changed things in my VERY small program because of things that I have learned on the board and I feel that I and my dogs are much better for learning it.  My point is that so many new comers are not as persistant as I to learn and are turned away without being given even a chance. 
You may have missed some of my posts so here goes
First post was right AFTER RR screwed me.  I was looking for a dog AFTER the RR thing.  RR drug that situation into the dog wanted threat.
Then tons of RR amelia threads followed.  I wanted the dang thing finished and completely abandoned the threads.
Then, looking for a trainer I got on and asked, followed up and used trainer (I think you missed this one)
Then, after the FIASCO happened I wrote to warn others and even more had come forward that they had had similar Horror stories with the guy.
Then I came on and offered notes on a seminar I attended.  I gave notes to four people from board.
Spewed how GREAT seminar was.
Then about Ivan can on and gushed Happy, Happy, Joy, Joy feelings about his methods.

Now there was some others, but I can't readily pull up the memory file.

My point here is that I use this board for information.  I never try to claim that I know more than the next guy.  If you look at my website that phil put up you can see my philosophy is not to say I have the NEXT TOP DOG, but I have and sell what I want, like, and need.  Better yet,
"My dogs are not imported to show; they are here because they have three qualities. One, they are level headed dogs. Meaning, they are not nuts. They can be in situations that are social and behave with manners without being told. They can further be trusted around small rambuntious children. The dogs here MUST be good with small children. Two, they are physically beautiful. I am very particular about my dogs looks. When we go anyplace with our dogs, we always get positive comments on them. And third, they must have the nerve and talent to protect us. We demand that our males do this with a full heart because they want to! This is what I have and breed. When it comes to my puppies, which are very few, this is what I breed for. Although my dogs are Schutzhund titled, I am not into the latest Schutzhund champion or the newest best thing on the market, so, if that is what you are after, you should try a larger schutzhund breeder. I have titled dogs because that is what is expected of good dogs in Germany. If you want a dog that is bred for a stable mind, beauty, and ability to protect, and possibly shown, then you may like my puppies. Just look around and let me know if you have any questions"

You asked what I breed for, there it is.  Note, that I always have recommened that people that look at my dogs, investigate and look around, because dogs are an emotional, finicial, and physical investment not to be entered into lightly.

But, I would also like to say THANK YOU for making such good points and in such an approachable manner! 

Sorry about any misspelled words.

W

First of all, anyone who makes a mistake shouldn't have to pay for it forever; I believe that people can make huge bloopers and then go on to be great people, who do good for the breed, and it's really hard to do that if you get slammed every time you try to do ANYthing.  I think it's great that people fall in love with the GSD and get very enthusiastic about this beautiful, noble breed.  So I will say this gently.

"I never try to claim that I know more than the next guy. If you look at my website that phil put up you can see my philosophy is not to say I have the NEXT TOP DOG"

But you DO say things like your dogs have the SG-1 "title," when it's not a title at all.  Neither is the BH a title.  And you repeatedly refer to the "champion" bitch you're importing, and she isn't a champion at all!  She has NO titles at all, yet you keep calling her a "champion."  And yes, "confirmation," which you talk about a lot on your website, is Dogs 101.  Didn't you also talk about winning "High in Trial" at a show, when what you meant was High Scoring Dog in the A (meaning the less experienced) classes?  "High in Trial" means just that, High in TRIAL.  All these things, to people who know dogs, make it look as though you are definitely trying to bamboozle puppy buyers.  If you are stating all these things out of ignorance instead of deliberately trying to fool people, yes, there's a difference, but that's what people are trying to say: you either are deliberately trying to fool ignorant puppy buyers, or else you yourself need to learn a lot more, and saying untrue things (like calling a totally non-titled dog a "champion," and telling prospective buyers that your dogs have all these titles (BH, SG-1), when these things are not titles), yes, that puts you in the red flag category.

And considering how you bashed JR on here, to use a photo of his helper training your dog on your website?  Oy.

So: WHY are you referring repeatedly to your no titles, to-be-imported bitch as a "champion"?

Windy, with all due respect, a recent thread about your Pit rescue would be a good example of what I mean...  You took the dog to the vet, decided to give meds yourself and off-handedly dismissed any concerns that were brought forward.  You really treated people like they were idiots and you, the expert.  Now, maybe no ill effects came of that, but it was the attitude that spoke volumes.  That's just a recent incident that comes directly to mind.  I'm really glad that you had the heart and the means to take this girl and her baby in.  It says that there is some good there, but you gave no regard to any consequences that may have occurred by flatly stating you would be able to live with your decision and those consequences.

Anyone have a shovel?????

Attitudes say it all. Some people come here and learn and many end up being great contributors and many here, including those you like to slam, enjoy helping them. Others come here, try to take as much as they can and then hope they can get as much information as possible to benefit themselves. Period. And they come, as do you, seeking absolution from the rest of us for doing things they have neither the experience or knowledge to do. Add to that a propensity to slam every person who calls you on it, your propensity to slam people who are very knowledgeable and have been unfortunate enough to involve themselves with you, and one sees why some of us have little sympathy for you. Few of us believe your statements about "coming here to learn".

Many, many new comers have come here over years and learned and not been arrogant or committing the same kinds of actions that you have. When people call you on things, you lash out and close your mind. The latest great example was telling people that you WERE going to vaccinate dogs who clearly were ill, against the advice of so many here who suggested it was not appropriate.

On more than one occasion people have tried to point out to you why you are not particularly "welcomed" with open arms here. It has NOTHING to do with your being a new comer wlpool. It has everything to do with excuses, and continued false justifications and a clear perception from many that you are in this for one reason, make that two.....money and your ego. It has to do with a clear perception that you don't really give a shit about what anyone says, if it does not agree with what you already think. To hell with learning anything or opening your mind.

Grow up, shut up, and stop trying to ingratiate yourself to people. Do the right thing and as so many have pointed out time and time again, including Tess above, learn and serve your due apprenticeship before talking about things you know nothing about. Further, when something does not work out, like the training deal of late, don't come here expecting sympathy when, in fact, clearly you had no clue. I would be embarrassed to have the helper on my website after all you said about your trainer. People like you, who have no clue about training, often misunderstand what will happen in training for SchH. But most don't then readily blame the entire thing on a reputable person who is well experienced in the sport. Learn about what the terms you use really mean.....including what is and is not a title, what is temperament, what is and is not proper structure, etc. etc. And stop breeding until you know ----- unless it really is about money and ego. Stop posting inane comments designed to bring attention to yourself and your breeding program. Stop posting asking who certain people are. And, as you well know, many you accuse of being trolls are well known to many here, by name and even address. You don't have to like the fact that people don't think much of your character, but it might go along way to find a way to demonstrate that yes, you can learn, and you can change, and you can do more than public character assassination for those you meet along the way who try to help you.

Beetree,

 

THANK YOU for the morning chuckle!!   I knew when I read the first FGT reference that the point would be completely missed....and, indeed it was!!   Your reference was spot on, btw! 

Hanz went SG 6 in Germany. Where did you get the SG 1 at a Regional Show from as there is no data to be found anywhere?

Why do you want to enter him in the German Sieger Show? A show he is most likely not fit for, even with the best handler in the world? You should attend and learn at the Regional shows and the American Siegershow first before even thinking going over the pond.

....and then Beetree comes chiming in with her "no nothing post-- just to heap on -- why don't you just butt out you brown-nose A/wipe !!