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by steve1 on 20 March 2010 - 07:03
Hunter9
i know you did but you only live in one country what about other countries, now Pientje has replied on Holland so now we are getting somewhere
Mr Smith
You highlight my paragraph, then tell me what to do, but in my text i already outline what i will do and it has already been done before you posted, i wait an answer.
What i can see in the next 25 years is a complete change in the German Shepherd Dog, We are already seeing it in the American Dog now, there jaws to me are more square with more pronounced features, I do wonder looking at some if they have not been crossed somewhere along the line already but without people knowing
Wresleman
The only reply i can give you and the rest who think this is a good Practice is to go for another breed of Dog right away from the German Shepherd if you are not entirely satisfied with the Performance of the Breed for the work it does, For as i said above in one of my posts You can Cross breed any dog and i will guarantee that in every litter of every generation you will get a different result and a different type of dog regards Stature, conformation, and temperament, Simply because it is a best mix and all crosses of any type of living being will be the same
What you are doing is in fact trying to win the football pools only with dogs most never do it every time you cross these dogs you will get a different type evolve cross breeding it is a lottery in most part But Guys who do it will carry on looking for that elusive product, But in doing so you will leave behind a lot of Mutts mostly unwanted for you will surly discard them along the way, So the mountain of unwanted dogs get bigger and the Breed its self goes deeper in decline
Steve1
i know you did but you only live in one country what about other countries, now Pientje has replied on Holland so now we are getting somewhere
Mr Smith
You highlight my paragraph, then tell me what to do, but in my text i already outline what i will do and it has already been done before you posted, i wait an answer.
What i can see in the next 25 years is a complete change in the German Shepherd Dog, We are already seeing it in the American Dog now, there jaws to me are more square with more pronounced features, I do wonder looking at some if they have not been crossed somewhere along the line already but without people knowing
Wresleman
The only reply i can give you and the rest who think this is a good Practice is to go for another breed of Dog right away from the German Shepherd if you are not entirely satisfied with the Performance of the Breed for the work it does, For as i said above in one of my posts You can Cross breed any dog and i will guarantee that in every litter of every generation you will get a different result and a different type of dog regards Stature, conformation, and temperament, Simply because it is a best mix and all crosses of any type of living being will be the same
What you are doing is in fact trying to win the football pools only with dogs most never do it every time you cross these dogs you will get a different type evolve cross breeding it is a lottery in most part But Guys who do it will carry on looking for that elusive product, But in doing so you will leave behind a lot of Mutts mostly unwanted for you will surly discard them along the way, So the mountain of unwanted dogs get bigger and the Breed its self goes deeper in decline
Steve1
by akamai dog training on 20 March 2010 - 18:03
steve1 im sorry but i think your not thinking with in opean mind i would never need this dog to be akc in 40 years beacouse they will destroy it its just for work and sport i like my dutchys and there a mutt but there the best dogs i think....... and i like all the working breeds out there...
by akamai dog training on 20 March 2010 - 18:03
nope im from up north ms wi area
by steve1 on 20 March 2010 - 18:03
Akamal dog training
Strange, that i am the one not thinking right is it not, when we have two perfectly good breeds who do a job well enough. Yet you and others like you want to ruin what is good in the hope of getting something better, In other words you are playing the lottery field, You cannot tell me about genetics i have been working and breeding live stock in some form or the other plus going into more technical detail than you would ever think for around 60 years
What you will breed by crossing pure and simply is a Mutt nothing else, No designer Dog but a Mutt, that is what a cross bred product of a animal crossed between too different breeds of the same specie is
Now several of you Guys have said all you want is for this crossbred to do is work
Work at what Police, Protection What may i ask,
For i can tell you wise men this you would never be allowed to work that crossbred on a Schutzund competition over here in Belgium, it is not allowed
Simply if a Dog does not have a FCI Pedigree then it cannot compete in IPO / Schutzund Competitions
If a Dog is of a pure breed but has no Pedigree it can compete in Shows, when a Dog then gets a certain Qualification Twice in shows it can then apply for a Working Card, with this Card he can then compete in Schutzund Competitions
I would not think a Mixed Breed Dog would get the necessary Show Qualifications so easy and without them he cannot get a working card, Plus it would have no pedigree officially that is what i have been talking about, and i am certain it is correct what i say but am waiting conformation, but i know it to be right but to be 100% sure because there will be doubters among you what i say for sure as some always know best
The things i have outlined above are the rules of the Belgian Kennel Club KKUSH not of the Malinos Breed Associations
What you Guys can do in the USA is not known to me, Your rules are probably different of that i would not be surprised for some of the things some of you come out with certainly is not the norm over here, but you will not get away with the same practices over here that is for sure
It really makes me think when so many people think they are creators of another breed Sorry Guys you are not like the Founder Max of this breed who developed the German Shepherd Dog, Those sort of people do not come along very often all you are doing is a hit and miss job like put a little of this in a little of that into the pot and hope for the best and in the wake of it all you breed is a lot of unwanted dogs, But then i guess some of you have no scruples or morals
Steve1
Strange, that i am the one not thinking right is it not, when we have two perfectly good breeds who do a job well enough. Yet you and others like you want to ruin what is good in the hope of getting something better, In other words you are playing the lottery field, You cannot tell me about genetics i have been working and breeding live stock in some form or the other plus going into more technical detail than you would ever think for around 60 years
What you will breed by crossing pure and simply is a Mutt nothing else, No designer Dog but a Mutt, that is what a cross bred product of a animal crossed between too different breeds of the same specie is
Now several of you Guys have said all you want is for this crossbred to do is work
Work at what Police, Protection What may i ask,
For i can tell you wise men this you would never be allowed to work that crossbred on a Schutzund competition over here in Belgium, it is not allowed
Simply if a Dog does not have a FCI Pedigree then it cannot compete in IPO / Schutzund Competitions
If a Dog is of a pure breed but has no Pedigree it can compete in Shows, when a Dog then gets a certain Qualification Twice in shows it can then apply for a Working Card, with this Card he can then compete in Schutzund Competitions
I would not think a Mixed Breed Dog would get the necessary Show Qualifications so easy and without them he cannot get a working card, Plus it would have no pedigree officially that is what i have been talking about, and i am certain it is correct what i say but am waiting conformation, but i know it to be right but to be 100% sure because there will be doubters among you what i say for sure as some always know best
The things i have outlined above are the rules of the Belgian Kennel Club KKUSH not of the Malinos Breed Associations
What you Guys can do in the USA is not known to me, Your rules are probably different of that i would not be surprised for some of the things some of you come out with certainly is not the norm over here, but you will not get away with the same practices over here that is for sure
It really makes me think when so many people think they are creators of another breed Sorry Guys you are not like the Founder Max of this breed who developed the German Shepherd Dog, Those sort of people do not come along very often all you are doing is a hit and miss job like put a little of this in a little of that into the pot and hope for the best and in the wake of it all you breed is a lot of unwanted dogs, But then i guess some of you have no scruples or morals
Steve1
by MBPlayer on 20 March 2010 - 19:03
Steve1 Your a pretty long winded chap aren't you. I THINK every1 here understands what you are saying. IF they are NOT doing it on a regular basis and when and IF they do, do it they have the right homes for them then there is no problem. You don't have to feed them or care for them. There's probably hundred's if not thousands more pure bred GSD's that are in shelter's. Feed your's and let other's feed what they like. They don't affect you do they? Not really. You breed or get dogs from a breeder that has a specific breeding standard and program so let Other people do what they want. Your a little bit to pushy. By the way " You cannot tell me about genetics i have been working and breeding live stock in some form or the other plus going into more technical detail than you would ever think for around 60 years" I thought you were 70? If that is right you were doing genetic and technical breeding when you were 10?! You shouldn't even be on this board if you were a GENIUS at that age. Should be Rich with all that knowledge. Anyway maybe a little more tolerance and bit more of keeping the ol mouth in check would go a long way for a Nice old man like yourself. You are likeable in your own way. By the way your handywork is quite impressive.
Player
Player
by Gustav on 20 March 2010 - 19:03
The mixing of German Shepherds, Malinois, and Dutch shepherds is a practice that the people in the United States got from workingline breeders primarily in Holland. Many top KNPV breeders have utilized these practices. I have never owned a mixed breed dog and don't desire to, but if I was a police officer and was looking for a working dog, a KNPV title is the first place I would look. Oh, by the way, last time I looked Holland was in Europe, and is known for having very very nice working dogs. Shouldn't the critcism be given to them instead of the people over in America as they started this practice??? Maybe its me, but we can always point out what we do over here wrong, EVEN when we are only coping things from Europe. I just don't understand!
by steve1 on 20 March 2010 - 20:03
Player
Less of the Old Man bit, age may be 70 but i move around like someone half tnat age i can still put up a fair trot for 5 miles or so and i do not feel old at all
To me it is the ethics of ever needing to cross breed and produce a Mutt whatever the outcome in the long run it will not be any better than the original two breeds which are pretty good as they are, It is meddling from people who do not have a clue is what is disturbing to me, and breed Willy Nilly just to see what evolves
As for my interest in Breeding that goes back to when i was 7 years old, at 9 years old i won the headmasters prize at school for an essay on Inbreeding and Line breeding to create a family of Racing pigeons, and 60 years later still going strong and Winning so proof is in the pudding and have done so at top level all created and bred by me, plus through bred Race Horses were my interest
I fail to see how any of us who disagree with this practice to be at fault in posting our views,Perhaps i carry on more than some but i feel it right to do so when others seem to take the breed so lightly, Are we not supposed to be trying to better the breeding of the original Dog that does not mean by crossing it out to something else
However i will probably be asleep when others post if any reply to my post above I wait with interest to here if they can Compete in the Schutzund Competitions in the USA and any other Country with a Cross bred Dog as is described above G.S + Mali for i think one or two have said they can but i wait to hear for sure
Gustav
I live in Belgium and i go by there rules, so what the Dutch do is nothing to do with Belgium, However i would still like to hear if they can compete in Schutzund Competitions with there cross bred G.S + Mali products, If they can then something is very wrong with the system and needs sorting out fast for if they can compete in Holland with these Dogs then who is to know what they use for the WUSV competition but somehow i doubt they can compete in ScH with these half breds
Steve1
Less of the Old Man bit, age may be 70 but i move around like someone half tnat age i can still put up a fair trot for 5 miles or so and i do not feel old at all
To me it is the ethics of ever needing to cross breed and produce a Mutt whatever the outcome in the long run it will not be any better than the original two breeds which are pretty good as they are, It is meddling from people who do not have a clue is what is disturbing to me, and breed Willy Nilly just to see what evolves
As for my interest in Breeding that goes back to when i was 7 years old, at 9 years old i won the headmasters prize at school for an essay on Inbreeding and Line breeding to create a family of Racing pigeons, and 60 years later still going strong and Winning so proof is in the pudding and have done so at top level all created and bred by me, plus through bred Race Horses were my interest
I fail to see how any of us who disagree with this practice to be at fault in posting our views,Perhaps i carry on more than some but i feel it right to do so when others seem to take the breed so lightly, Are we not supposed to be trying to better the breeding of the original Dog that does not mean by crossing it out to something else
However i will probably be asleep when others post if any reply to my post above I wait with interest to here if they can Compete in the Schutzund Competitions in the USA and any other Country with a Cross bred Dog as is described above G.S + Mali for i think one or two have said they can but i wait to hear for sure
Gustav
I live in Belgium and i go by there rules, so what the Dutch do is nothing to do with Belgium, However i would still like to hear if they can compete in Schutzund Competitions with there cross bred G.S + Mali products, If they can then something is very wrong with the system and needs sorting out fast for if they can compete in Holland with these Dogs then who is to know what they use for the WUSV competition but somehow i doubt they can compete in ScH with these half breds
Steve1
by hunter k-9 on 20 March 2010 - 21:03
Steve1, In the USA you can do Sch Competitions with mix breeds, your not going to take one to the WUSV but you can still have fun and do Sch.
by steve1 on 20 March 2010 - 21:03
Hunter-9
If you can do Schutzund competitions in the USA with mixed breeds then why are they not eligible for the WUSV then.
How can you have parts of rules within the governing organization that makes no sense at all, It makes a mockery of the Sport on the whole, I wonder if any one else from another country will reply i will look in the morning, in the meantime i bid you all goodnight it is time for Bed
Steve1
If you can do Schutzund competitions in the USA with mixed breeds then why are they not eligible for the WUSV then.
How can you have parts of rules within the governing organization that makes no sense at all, It makes a mockery of the Sport on the whole, I wonder if any one else from another country will reply i will look in the morning, in the meantime i bid you all goodnight it is time for Bed
Steve1
by akamai dog training on 20 March 2010 - 22:03
shz is a sport and thats just it theres border colliess that have shz 3 what dos that say about shz???? idk about you steve1 but i would put money one the mix breed shz is a gsd breed but its funny that malis are kicking ass in it.... fax are in the points and i know some malis that would show up alot of gsd !
but your very old fashion and I can respect that but, im like about 40 years younger then you and like i tell every one times are changing... you chang with it or you get left behind theres better ways to train dogs and breed them
but your very old fashion and I can respect that but, im like about 40 years younger then you and like i tell every one times are changing... you chang with it or you get left behind theres better ways to train dogs and breed them
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