stringing dog up - Page 5

Susan, there is stuff in Koehler's books that most of us will agree should never be used. You've just cited three instances.

But that doesn't mean you should throw the baby out with the bath water. A lot of what he says is very useful. There are times when clicker training and treats are just not enough.

If an aggressive dog came back up the leash at me, I'd just hope to hell I had enough strength to hang him from his collar until he changed his mind!

Fortunately, I've never had to do this.

Yet.

If I ever did, the next time I worked with that dog, he'd be wearing a muzzle.

Remember Barbara Woodhouse, "No Bad Dogs"?  A really gentle English lady, who said you should praise your dogs using your 'wee' voice (high pitched voice). 

 IIRC, in her book, she talks about stringing up a really badassed, aggressive dog, and telling him how horrible he was. I don't believe she choked the dog out, but she did suspend the dog in the air so he was helpless. I'd need to dig the book out and reread it, but it was the first step in reforming a dog that others considered hopeless.

Edit: did a search on Woodhouse, to refresh my memory, and found a very interesting clip of her working with William Shatner and his dobermans!

http://www.livevideo.com/video/719084DDFD254DB19854C28747D146A2/1982-barbara-woodhouse.aspx

rainforestscouts - good one, too bad school teachers don't to that anymore. our kids might learn someting in class.

Dealing with dog aggression certainly is as complex as dealing with human aggression, and no one thing will work all the time with every dog. It is absolutely right that creating more fear is not the cure for fear. It's also interesting that certain types of corrections will actually aggravate some types of aggression behaviors. People who have Sociopathic Personality Disorder actually become more adept sociopaths with conventional therapy. People with Borderline Personality Disorder don't do well with conventional therapy either as it reinforces their fears. There are some treatments that need to be done by professionals who are aware of the possible consequences - whether it might be homicide, suicide, or dog attack. 

The whole idea of using an extreme correction (not to the point of causing true harm) is that you hopefully will not have to do it more than once or twice to the same dog, and it is to stop certain behaviors/proclivities dead in their tracks. Better to do have the dog destroyed later, and live with the harm caused by the aggression/bad behavior. People are much more difficult. Believe me, I would have liked to have strung up one or two of my clients but I doubt it would have done any good even if it was legal.

After all is said and done,
You might just try raising a better dog...

 

Slamdunc,

Thanks so much for the  TABASCO  CURE lol.........I sent you a detailed PM but since it was suggested on this thread I just wanted to say it worked for me and Kaiser!.
 
I was out for a few hours this afternoon-stopped at the store-bought Tabasco sauce.
Husband was driving-I was in the back with Kaiser-as usual he started looking for "road villains" so was I:)...and as you suggested I waited (for the aggressive crazy lunging  to start -and yes I will work on stopping that before it gets to that point in the future but this needed stopping NOW-. and as he lunged over me I calmy placed the Tabasco soaked paper towel over his muzzle and he stopped in his tracks!!!! . That was a first!!  I had the best ride ever in a looooongg time!! 
After that he would act like he was going to get started again - looked at my hand -sat down and calmly look out the window!!!
 That German Son of a Gun lol why couldn't I be as convincing as TABASCO SAUCE LOL! 
I am deleriously happy and intend to work on stopping him from even getting to that point in the future!!!

Lesson learned-prong made him escalate-e-collar in the past used to thwart aggression failed- counter conditioning with treats and praise failed ( I am only saying in this particular case for me that all these things did not work on him in my CAR)..they are all great tools and are  what I use on other dogs for countering conditioning and desensitizing etc .

It worked - he stopped!!!!  Thanks to you I may have a safer and calm and quitet ride !!

Thankyou!!
Katrina

That's great, I'm glad it worked.  As you mentioned a good thing about the Tabasco is that it doesn't elevate the aggression level as a pain induced correction (prong or E-collar)  can.  Sometimes you need to try several different methods till you find the one that works for that individual dog.  Remember to stay calm;  just as you did and be ready to correct when you see the behavior about to start.  Good job.  I sent you a PM as well. 

Good luck with him

Jim