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by steve1 on 15 March 2009 - 06:03
To start with why the sarcasem, I asked you some straight foreward questions because i was suprised at the evaluation fee as soon as a person joined your club, Nothing wrong in asking that and polite as well, nothing in my letter which was not right in the way i put it, or mean't in a nasty way, and i asked you if you came from the USA and i told you what happens here in Belgium, it was only a learning curve nothing else
Now if you have a young dog, not you or king kong can say if it will come up to scratch just by watching it one time or even two or three no matter how good you think you are
Now, If you had said
We charge a fee at our club to see if the handler is up to standard and to evaluate them, meaning handling a dog then yes, that is a different thing al together
And by the way you write your replies in the aggressive way you did, then you my friend would not get into your club
For you need to take anger management classes to curb your bad temper and improve your manners first
Remember all that you portray in your mind or body language transfers to your dog when working, and it will react accordingly
Have a Good Day
Steve
by happyday on 15 March 2009 - 12:03
Steve 1
Sorry if you feel I am aggressive - I didn't mean it that way - are you referring to the first comment or the large lettering. First comment I will say ok -aggressive- but large lettering - I cant see the little letters..lol...
I do have to say Uberland if you got a little Indian in you - you can get something from the Native Indians - I think if you got 1 percentage then you qualify for a check - at least here in Alabama you can.....lol
In answer to your question about the evaluation fee - we use to have a different policy. People could come out - no charge - 6 times at least before deciding if schutzhund was for them - but frankly - most people that have new pups - or younger dog's don't have the dedication that training needs. We (club members) would help them work their dog's - and by the 4-6 times - they just fizzed out. Time wasted... Whether or not they had a great dog - or a dog not so good..... Our club doesn't charge big dollars to join - and the monthly fee is small as well.
The answer to questions on how can you evaluate a dog in one visit -I'm not saying that you can - but you can get the jist if the dog has any drive, likes food and isn't scared of his shadow. That is all that the evaluation tells... I personally don't need somebody to tell me if my dog can cut the cheese - Funny how people have a problem with the word, "Evaluation" - never really thought of it affending anyone - kinda like the fraze "You People" - doesnt affend me - but say it in a room full of black people and look out....
Moons I got the brewski - and Fonzy does live down the road....
by steve1 on 15 March 2009 - 15:03
Your first line in your reply to me was saracatic but never the less means nothing ,
My reason for asking you was according to HansK9 you asked him for $25 to i presume join your club whether that be correct only you two people know, but if it were true then it is a funny way of doing business,
The only person who would get my money is the secretary of the club and only after i had evaluated the club facillities it to be up to what i wanted and expected,
Then if it was i would watch a whole training session, and during that time i would be evaluating the people there, and trainers more than i would the Dogs, If all was well then i would ask to join
I understand your point of people wasting time and perhaps not thinking the sport was for them and it can and does happen,
As far as i know our club gets about 10 euros a member a year out of the 65 euros the rest goes to the govening body of the DSchutzund sport in Belgium the VVDH, and in due course they pay a fair bit back to the members
All the Drinks and Beers are cheap at the club all training is free, all help costs us nothing, so for our 65 euros a year we get good service from theClub and the VVDH
Why is racisem coming into the thread, For me i do not care what religion or lack off you guys have, I do not bother what colour or creed you are, I do not care if you are Sky Blue Pink,
The things i care about is what is beneath the skin and whether a person is sincere and honest, that is all i care about in any one person nothing else counts
Steve
by happyday on 15 March 2009 - 15:03
Steve:
I am the club secretary. Any money's paid go to our treasurer. HansK9 came to me about training at my club. USA clubs sound different than clubs in your country. We are members of USA Schutzhunds - but we are individual clubs. We support our individual clubs. Due's from the members pays our taxes, pay for our trials, pay for our lights, etc. Our members are individuals that have dog's - we aren't professional dog trainers that are in the business to train other peoples dogs. We are a group of people that have a common interest. Schutzhund. We help each other in training each others dogs. That's all. It sounds like the clubs you go to are more than a Club. The are body that has formed a business. Not really sure your clubs are the same as the ones here in USA.
It is up to a individual to come and see if they fit our club. The $25 that I advised Amin of is an option - I also invited him to come and watch. No charge.. If he didn't want his dog looked at then that was fine as well. He does have a lot of dogs. As everyone has said on this site - it was merely my intent to find out what dog he was going to bring -and I ask him if he wanted us to evaluate his dog then that would be the fee - because we aren't in the business to train other peoples dog - it is up to the owner to train their on dog. It was his option if he wanted us to look at his dog. Our members are only allowed two dogs to train at one time.
Amin came to me for training advise. My club, again, is a club of individual people - not professional dog trainers, so I expected people that contact a person about coming to a club - realize that it is a club - we don't advertise on our website as a professional dog training business - there are alot of business that do advertise in Birmingham, AL that do that for a living. It just isn't what we do.
by steve1 on 15 March 2009 - 17:03
If you are the Secretary of your club then you have the right to ask for the fee upfront, over Belgium i do not think it much different to over in the USA. You must have a govening body who makes the rules etc for the sport
The UK must be the Kennel Club and in Belgium it is the VVDH 'Vereniging voor Duite Herdershond'
meaning it works for the German Shepherd
So you must have a similar body over there.
All our clubs in Belgium are known as Kring Groups my main club is Kring 14, This govening body runs the sport and all rules come from there
Now as for individual clubs and trainers, i know of no club in Belgium who charges for its trainers. No one is a professional, and no one person thinks he is, They are just very experienced people who have done well in the sport in there own right over the years, who love to teach or guide other people, and why do they do it and all for free is
because they love the sport and the German Shepherd Dog and that is it
We are lucky to have two top people in our club
One is the Belgian Schutzund Captain who is also a world renowned Judge in the Sport, and the other man is also a Qualified Schutzund Judge now retired from that bit, He is a renowned Track layer much in demand and both are Wizards at training not only Dogs but more important the people too, Both are good friends and i am lucky indeed to have there help
We have some fellows in the club who have been in the sport for a very long time, only this morning one such fellow at the training club was training his dog, it did not do something right, Marcel one of the two i have mentioned above said something to him and he did it without questioning Marcel, Never the less it worked everyone takes note of what they say no matter how long they have been in the sport all have the greatest respect for these two people who put in a lot of there time without asking anything back, We are lucky indeed
Steve
by Mystere on 15 March 2009 - 19:03
by steve1 on 15 March 2009 - 22:03
Thank you for explaining it
Ours is a Club for people to train there Dogs as is all the clubs affiliated to the VVDH, none are run on a profit making business,
The Clubs hold trials every now and then our club did in Feb of this year another one in November
Plus our Club will hold the Belgian Championship Schutziund Competition later this year this is organised by the VVDH and the best Dogs in Belgium will compete It will be a big event and will take a bit of organizing
Steve
Happyday
We also have to pay for the electric we use, all our Training is done outside on a field, All year round twice evenings and in the winter we use Floodlights we do not have indoor training in Belgium, So the 10 euros goes to pay for this and this is all we pay once a year
We make a few cents on a bottle of beer or cola etc but it all goes back into the club
No one gets paid for anything here
Steve
by happyday on 15 March 2009 - 22:03
Mystere - I appreciate the help in explanations. I feel like I am on trial.. All for a $25 "FEE"
Steve are you in a schutzhund club or a party club? We train in the morning -and in the evening- do Europeans drink beer in the AM while training? I can't imagine.... lol...
by Mystere on 15 March 2009 - 23:03
by steve1 on 16 March 2009 - 07:03
Party Club, You are Joking, The Sport is taken very seriously over here in Belgium, No country in the world does it better than Belgium results in the WUSV tell that, and just think You could get the whole of Belgium lost in one state in the USA and never find it again, It is a tiny country no bigger than 280 kms by 300kms, and that is small and with over 50 major clubs in that area tells it is not a party sport in Belgium, It is an out and out Dog Sport country
Do you only concern yourself with your own club what about trials in your club and do not the members trial there dogs at other clubs who hold them during the year
We have a club house where we can get a drink of Beer, Coffee, Tea or hot Chocolate and even soup. and believe me when you have been working and watching others working there dogs for over three hours in the freezing cold as late as 10.30 on a winters night, with temps sometimes MInus 15 centigrage, you need a drink afterwards plus we get together for a short time before going home, That is not for the faint hearted in the sport, and we do that twice in the nights on weekdays and once on the Sunday mornings, By the way every SchH Dog club in Belgium has its own Club house we are not the only ones, so that makes at least 50 club houses and you can get the same as ours in every club.
Ask Ronny van den Berghe if his club is a party club, probably the most famous SchH competitor in the world today, and if he is selected this year and i think he will after watching his dog and himself work in the first selection trial for the WUSV
He would look at you and probably not even give you an answer
Your bit in your last post makes me wonder how much interest and you and your members have outside your own club not to have heard of how intense the Belgians are about there sport, and the more knowledgable people on this forum do not need to be told, they knew a long time ago
Steve
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