bigger heads - Page 5

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These are big heads for 4.5 month old pups!!

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This mom - Tina

And of coarse Zidane is the Dad!!

Von Hayden Zidane/Tina Puppies

Eagle's profile

Thanks Chris, Sunsilver for your opinions

One more question

has somebody seen jeck noricum's gait ?

Was he able to move well with a bid head ?

Eagle is a handsome boy!

I tend to like a nice sized head also, as long as it is in proportion to the body.  I definitely do not care for the "collie heads".

Of course a dog with a big head can work. However, shorten the muzzle, give it a lot of stop, round eyes and an overly long soft palate and it ain't gonna be tending sheep 24/7 or doing much of anything that would require a lot of endurance. Could it earn a Sch title? Of course, so could a mastiff if it had the right drives.  A mastiff would probably have trouble with an AD though. Would it look like a GSD? No.

Let's not confuse a big head with an incorrect head, they are definitely not the same thing at all.  Look at Eagle's side view - that is NOT a rottie head, he has minimal stop as called for in the standard. The worst I see on any workinglines posted here is a wide skull. No rottie heads.

Who would argue that a bad head can totally spoil an otherwise good dog? Over 50% of breed type is in the head. Big heads are fine on males. Big heads with too short muzzles, too much stop, round eyes, domey skulls and restricted airways are not right for a tending/working dog. I seriously doubt anyone who has posted to this thread owns such a  dog. The photos we see here are 100% showlines. Again, I'm not going to mention any names, but one of dogs with the most incorrect heads according to his photos and IMO is one that is ooo'd and aaah's over every time anyone wants to  select an example of a dog with very dark pigment. To me the dog looks like a Bernese Mountain Dog crossed with a Saint Bernard.

Anand,

I have seen Jeck in Germany. He certainly moved well. Otherwise, he would have never been Sieger. Jeck did not have a big, but a strong head. In my opinion, almost none of these dogs shown here have "big" heads. The correct term would be a strong head. The head has to fit the overall built of a dog. If you have a "stallion-type" male (SV judge Schweikert used that term), it would be awful if he had a fine and chiseled head. A dog like that needs a strong head, like Jeck. When you look at Jeck, you will find that he had a shorter and wider muzzle which gave the impression of a stronger head. Ursus von Batu inherited that head, along with the less than desirable loose lips. A short muzzle will always give the appearance of a bigger head. A more medium-strong dog (like Pakros d'Ulmental for example, or Larus von Batu) would usually have a medium-sized head. Nothing wrong with it, as long as it is in proportion. No GSD should have a Rotti or Bulldog head. The standard calls for a noble head. A lot of factors influence the impression and actual size of a head: muzzle, size of forehead, jaws and (believe it or not) even the color, pigmentation and markings.

One of the nicest heads in my opinion belongs to VA-Timo vom Berrekasten, which I have known up close and personal since he was a young dog: http://www.arlett.de/sables/index.html . Note his wide muzzle, but due to his dark color and markings you have to look close to see how strong his head actually is.

Chris