Which school of thought are you in??? - Page 4

Ok You know I have to ask you actually wrote a book?? I don't compete in sch I too live too far away.  I did drive to a club about 6 months back, I didn't care for most of the dogs there although they were pretty.  I spent alot of time wondering how in the world they passed the courage test.  I did laugh a little when I brought my boy out of the car and the first helper refused to take a bite from him just by looking at him, we found another helper that agreed and then wished he hadn't.  I did not realize there was such a difference in working dogs.  When working my boy is very serious his bites are clean and the out is automatic when the command is given.  When he's not working he's a big goofball.  I realized why it has been so hard to find the type of dog I want it does not appear to be the popular dog.  I have no intrest in the popular dog. Which has worked out well for me several times when people get a dog that is too much for them and I get it for a really good price! The problem I would run into with breeding is I don't have many people skills, I like you don't care for many people, I have a low tolerance for stupid, ignorance I can tolerate if the person is looking for the knowledge.  That's why I have dogs they are smarter than most people!!

No, I haven't written a book, but as much as I've written in this and other forums, there might be enough material for one!  Every article I've ever shared ended up on some numbskull's website or published in print without my permission, so there are some details and lessons I keep to myself now.  Maybe I'll include them in some future book/dvd package, or maybe for a priveledged inner-circle of breeders under secret oath.  ha ha.

  You are doing great  DONNERSTORM

Keep asking and keep the walls full of notes and new colors for your pedigrees.

You will have a book , also when you have about 10 yrs behind you...

YOu now see, how most of us operate here..We do our research, we breed for US, and for our way of doing things..BUT first we do years of what you are doing

ASKING and reading and wondering

Keep it up.... it helps others to re read what Daryl publishes here...Genetics is HARD to understand ...

I  am not a math or science person so I  have lots of difficulty digesting it all

YR

Thanks for the info vonissk. I do not know everything about everything ( but don't tell my husband that!  LOL) I will definately look for those books.  Yes Yr it does make sense to know this stuff and know it well if you are going to breed.  Unlike most people that seem to think it just takes a male and a female. Then again that's how they breed most people don't know why I would expect different in their dogs.  My grandmother used to say extreme intelligence is a very lonely thing, I have come to realize she was not wrong!! I did find several things you wrote by googling your name Daryl, but no books :(.  Can I ask what it is you do for a living.  Yr I love math and science so this is fun reading for me!

There are lots of confusing or conflicting interpretations of these breeding terms from varied sources.  Excerpts from Thomas Shaw's Animal Breeding (1913) ,indicate that inbreeding isn't so much a matter as how close. as it is a successive continuation of related breeding... and that linebreeding may stem from distantly related inbred strains.  By definition, that would make my very distantly related strains and so-called outcross (3-2 Bero sire & 3-4,5 Alf dam), actually a "linebreeding".  Another term, High Breeding, is basically defined as selection for Type, without regard to relationship.

In and in Breeding Defined The term in and in breeding properly indicates the breeding together of animals that are closely related for a number of successive generations It has reference to repetition and close continuity in the breeding together of the related animals whereas in breeding has reference to single acts of coupling relatives even though there should be occasional repetition in these acts Such repetition in breeding even at intervals would seem in a sense to involve in and in breeding of a weak sort but to avoid ambiguity the author prefers to include these under the head of in breeding No absolute rule has been chosen to define the exact degree of the relationship nor indeed can it be so chosen The animals of kin may be of the closest possible relationship as parent and progeny sister and brother or the relationship may be more distant.  The more close the relationship in the animals mated the more intense is the in and in breeding Since the degree of the relationship in the animals mated may differ much the results growing out of such mating will also differ much and this throws some light on the wide difference in view as to the value of in and in breeding

Line Breeding Defined Line breeding may defined as the process of breeding within the members of one family or of a limited number of possessed of similar types As usually conducted animals are inter bred which are not closely connected in the general lines of their blood Strictly speaking it is in a sense a continuation of in and in breeding the relationships in line breeding however more distant The animals that are line bred more commonly descended from animals that been bred in and in.  For instance from a foundation animals closely in and in bred several divergent streams may flow out These streams represent families and very probably or less divergent types When the streams fully divergent that is to say from the time families become distinctly separate the males chosen from within these families sometimes strains and from that separating period line breeding may be said to begin  But line breeding may also be the outcome the blending of two distinct strains each of which has probably been more or less in bred It differs from in breeding in the virtual exclusion of alien blood and in continuity The relationships in the former are in a sense closer When in breeding the blood may be promiscuous in its near origin When line breeding it is unmixed with extraneous blood from what may be regarded as its starting point Line breeding may be spoken of as repeated acts of in breeding the relations becoming less close as the starting point is receded from because of the increase in the number of the individuals

The Starting Point in Line Breeding As now understood it would not be possible in all instances to define

The Starting Point in Line Breeding As now understood it would not be possible in all instances to define exactly the starting point of line breeding It may commence with a pair of animals or with a limited number When it does in and in breeding of necessity is practiced at the first But it may also commence at a later period in the history of the breed More commonly it begins at that point where the outcome of in and in breeding diverges sufficiently to admit of the formation of distinct families descended wholly or chiefly from one ancestor In line breeding the males are subsequently chosen from this family

 

 Can I ask what it is you do for a living.

 

My boss would say, 'not very much'.  Seriously though, it has nothing to do with dogs or academics, and not apropriately worth mention on a public forum.  I consider my occupation to be a matter of privacy for me and the dogs, and don't want it to adversely shape public perception about me.  Let's just say I'm a strip dancer instead.

LOl Strip dancer it is!!

Yeah, the grow operation just wasn't successful enough, so I'm dancing like a puppet for the entertainment of some very rough women.

Since you're A type personality, try banging your head against this one.  It's a poultry breeder's linebreeding strategy.  The male #2 is the sire of the pairings numbered 3, 5, and 8 (he's bred to a daughter, and grandaughter).  Just the opposite, female #1 is the dam in pairings numbered 3, 4 (her son) and 6 (her grandson).  Thereafter, (I believe) the connections are resulting offspring to conduct linebreedings (rather than inbreedings).

Can you see where the loss of symmetry is?