Uncontrolable aggression..... - Page 4

Every once in a while Alpha has to make it known.    For some reason people are afraid to apply basic " Social Hierarchy".
In a pack the unstable dog will be attacked.  Alpha will squash the insecure, unstable behavior.  Once again this is all interpretation through a computer, so it is very impersonal.  so, without being there to really see first hand what is going on, advice is really subjective. 

As far as Pinching my own dogs, I will do what the dog requires at the moment in which it is required.  I have had unstable dogs come through, and this works.   My confident stable dogs are just that confident and stable. 

Hopefully I have made things a little clearer , if not Oh Well, another day will pass.

Hey Everyone,

Getting a little tense around here lol.  I am not as experienced as the two main people posting in here or anyone else for that matter, but I have dealt with aggressive dogs before, but aggression was directed towards dogs only.  One of the dogs I currently have is a Pit Bull with incredible lines, grandfater was #1 in the country UKC a while back, dual registered not sure the stats for AKC, great temperament by both parents.  What I am trying to get at is this dog was not what you normally see with these backyard breeders or hear on the news (if its true).  She loves people of all sizes as well as other dogs no matter what. 

She ended up being attacked twice at a dog park. She doesn't initiate nor join rough play, I had small too dogs as well who obviously couldn't interact that way w/o an injury taking place, so it was not allowed.  The second attack she did not recover emotionally in my opinion.  She, from then on was dog aggressive.  Some believe it happened because of her instincts/breed, but from everything I have experienced/read she was not of "NORMAL" age when aggression for her breed would start, plus the day after she was a different dog.  If a dog was near she would quietly show signs that if was off leash she would severyly hurt the other dog.  Now if the dog growls or barks aggressively even from a distance she would get into the red zone with a higher pitch whine/bark and it was go time.  I personally did not tolerate that whatsoever, nor think you should either especially with people aggression.  I know there are many ways to solve one problem.  Mine was taking the dogs on walks, in which I would always encounter other dogs, establish leadership and CONSISTENLY give corrections by leash with a choker placed at upper part of the neck BEFORE she escalated to level 2.  The key is Consistenly correct BEFORE he/she escalates, I cannot stress that enough.  I now can now have her heel next to another dog w/o issues.  Is she bestfriends with that dog, NOPE.  Can she be YUP, as long as she is properly introduced and the other dog isn't aggressive.  Do I wish my dog got along with EVERY other dog, you betcha. 

There is a lot more that needs to be done (for your situation) after what I did for my dog.  But I do truly believe its a great start.  Wouldn't it be great to walk anywhere and have your dog enjoy the walk no matter who or what was around?  As for trusting the dog to be greeted by children and dogs in his personal space NOPE, not until you get a trainer who is certified, has references, and has dealt with your specific situation with success to help you and even at that point Im sure he/she will be able to make and educated decision with it.  Just my .02

Travis

Travis, you took a Pit Bull to a dog park? Or really, any dog for that matter? Now that you've seen firsthand what can happen, I'm assuming and hoping that you don't do that anymore. She would've been fine possibly after the first time, but you took her back again?! Not a good idea, obviously. Now she's learned the best defense is a good offense, and I can't say I blame her. YOU caused this turnaround. Not  picking on you- just stating a fact. You allowed her to be attacked TWICE. My opinion, FWIW, is the attack simply opened a door in your dog that was always there. It had nothing to do with her age (you say she was not 'normal' age for this to set in), nor did it have to do with her instincts/breed in the typical way; sure, it had everything to do with it, but it could've lied dormant for quite a while longer had you not put her in that situation.

Human aggression is not part of a Pit Bull's temperament the way it can be in a GSD. I wouldn't hesitate to destroy a  HA Pit Bull, provided it was genetic and not a learned behavior. The temperament you're describing to me IS the norm for them. Most people who talk about Pit Bull temperament are talking about bizarre molosser crosses bred and sold as "pittbulls" "pitbulls" or many other slaughtered variations of the proper breed name, in an attempt to come up w/the biggest, baddest, most dangerous dog. Most others can not pick a Pit Bull out of a lineup if their life depends on it. Allow me to take this time to thank you for your proper spelling of the breed name, and you receive an extra bonus for proper capitalization.

Anyway, where I'm going with this is while some of your techniques are great, Travis, the motivation behind your dog's behavior and the OP's dog's behavior is totally different. His dog has no reason (no learned reason anyway) to behave this way. This is genetic w/his dog. YOUR dog, OTOH, learned the hard way that behaving and being all nicey-nice can sometimes get you attacked through no fault of your own. So, she changed her approach, lol. Plus, she discovered she liked to fight, as so many do. "It's go time" is a perfect description. The OP's dog is uncomfortable and acting out through a "the best defense is a good offense" MO. IMO, this dog is going to take a different approach to neutralize his reactions toward strangers and other dogs. On one hand, it should be easier since he's not had any bad experiences like your dog has, but on the other hand, he doesn't have the same stability your dog seems to have, so it could be much harder.

I do also agree, as stated in my previous posts, that the time for a correction is BEFORE he escalates. I also think the OP is probably contributing to his reactions. And lastly, I think that the OP isn't even reading our discussion anymore. LOL.

**Travis, I know you pointed out that more needs to be done w/this dog than yours; much of what I said was general reiteration- not trying to say you don't know this and didn't already say it.

Silly people! Why must you think that you need to be the "pack leader"? The dog knows you are not a dog. Dogs are not true pack animals anyway.

None of you have any right to judge whether or not a dog is "fearful". You only have the right to judge whether or not the reaction is acceptable or not acceptable. If it isnt acceptable then correct the dog.

It is true that the handler is most likely causing much of this behavior but now it is a cycle where the dog and handler both feed off one another. One must change to break the cycle. The dog isnt going to change so the handler must change what they are doing in the situations that the dog reacts.

 

Hey Jenni78,

YUP, I 100% screwed up.  I have never taken a dog to the dog park before and twice for that matter.  But with the reputation of the pit bull I wanted to make sure she was socialized BIGTIME at an early age to help prevent any issues.  I took precautions at the dog park asking if anyones dogs were aggressive and watched before I let her in (HUGE MISTAKE ON MY PART).  I wll never EVER make that mistake again with any breed/dog, and yes all my fault not hers.  I put her in that situation.

I do agree its in their nature to fight, but I have gotten her to the point if properly introduced she is fine with any dog, which I am very proud of her.

I apologize ahead of time for the dumb question, but I am new to forums and do not know the lingo.  Could you please tell me what MO, OP, IMO, OTOH and sorry for the reiteration.  Thx

Travis

Sorry, Travis. LOL.

MO- Modus Operandi

OP-original post/poster

IMO-in my opinion

OTOH-on the other hand

;-)

This is a low thresh hold dog,  a little sharp.  This type, make great deterrents. 
 I live in the boondocks, and am alone alot of the time, I'd take him!

In regards to taking pit bulls to a dog park:
I have taken my pit to  the dog park.  He likes to romp but is not aggressive unless his food dish is involved.  Now, some other dogs have gotten aggressive with him.  at least twice dogs have bitten him in his leg area.  He simply ignors them.  He understands play.  But   when they get more aggressive than play he ignores them as if they were not even there.  I don't take him there any more though because the peoples dog ettiquate seems a little off kilter.  I always felt like  i was waiting for some explosive thing to happen any minute.  Incidentally it is the gsd that is all out dog aggressive.  The pit bull loves the park and all of the dogs in the dog park. 

Robert