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by bgstout on 11 November 2009 - 04:11
Kim,
Forced to have a trial ? Bailing out USA clubs?
Let me go and get my boots, it's starting to get deep in here.
Last time I went to watch a WDA trial I was charged 10.00 for parking by the host club, no wonder the club made money.
Forced to have a trial ? Bailing out USA clubs?
Let me go and get my boots, it's starting to get deep in here.
Last time I went to watch a WDA trial I was charged 10.00 for parking by the host club, no wonder the club made money.
by Kim Gash on 11 November 2009 - 14:11
When I said "forced" absolutely I should haved used the term "required" and that is an up front requirement of USA. And you can get a waiver to not have one and also another new amendment is that it now can be an "event" ie even a helper's seminar/certification for the requirement.
As to "new found wealth". I am just as broke as anyone, but I have always contributed to various clubs and organziations, some was open knowledge and some was not. I have always donated as stated. Maybe I just got the ones who needed help, maybe they thought I was stupid and would just donate and they all now have savings in the bank or had a party :) Don't know and don't care - gave willingly and freely -
Glad to hear someone had enough voluteers at a WDA trial that was dedicated enough to stand and collect money for parking :) When I hosted nationls here one year for WDA, hardly anyone would do anything. The three USA clubs here pitched in at the time to help - thank God they were there. We missed a ton of parking income from non particpants, just the general public, because everyone wanted to watch the trial. :)
But yes, I have contributed, maybe I am just a soft touch and get conned, but they all have seemed to fall short or at least that is what they said. I think what maybe I did not convey right, is with all the stupid controversy, all the politics, and all the my club is better than your club BS and the upholding of the holy grail pursuit - is that personally I have to have rocks in my head to keep sending money to others to keep established stuff going - when I could spend less money and have a club in my back yard and be done with all the politics. Its supposed to be fun. That's a personal decision if charity should begin at home :) Sorry if I vented and anyone took it the wrong way.
The orginal gist of this thead was why the exlcusionary actions of USA - and like Yvette Woodards's resignation for all the work she has done on the magazine, I think one tends to feel a little burned if you have donated to USA in money, time, whatever and you are carved out and they don't want you if you belong to another club - some of the dual members really have done a lot for USA - just look at the lifetime membership list that bailed them out of the tax lien and if that had not happened, there would have been no USA. You think I sound a little upset, think what they feel.
Also go see Larry Pinkston's post on the Final Tought thread. I am not making this up. Here is another good example. Maybe other regions do alot better with participation.
OGBS - send me or post your website and show me your non-profit status etc. If your organziation is not a joke and for supporting you personally, meaning its legit, I would be happy to send you something. :)
I've got 20 dogs (some rescues) of my own, plus 18 cats (rescues), chickens and horses of my own to support, but when I have it happy to help a good cause out for animals. Also, I do not sell or give any animals away.
As to "new found wealth". I am just as broke as anyone, but I have always contributed to various clubs and organziations, some was open knowledge and some was not. I have always donated as stated. Maybe I just got the ones who needed help, maybe they thought I was stupid and would just donate and they all now have savings in the bank or had a party :) Don't know and don't care - gave willingly and freely -
Glad to hear someone had enough voluteers at a WDA trial that was dedicated enough to stand and collect money for parking :) When I hosted nationls here one year for WDA, hardly anyone would do anything. The three USA clubs here pitched in at the time to help - thank God they were there. We missed a ton of parking income from non particpants, just the general public, because everyone wanted to watch the trial. :)
But yes, I have contributed, maybe I am just a soft touch and get conned, but they all have seemed to fall short or at least that is what they said. I think what maybe I did not convey right, is with all the stupid controversy, all the politics, and all the my club is better than your club BS and the upholding of the holy grail pursuit - is that personally I have to have rocks in my head to keep sending money to others to keep established stuff going - when I could spend less money and have a club in my back yard and be done with all the politics. Its supposed to be fun. That's a personal decision if charity should begin at home :) Sorry if I vented and anyone took it the wrong way.
The orginal gist of this thead was why the exlcusionary actions of USA - and like Yvette Woodards's resignation for all the work she has done on the magazine, I think one tends to feel a little burned if you have donated to USA in money, time, whatever and you are carved out and they don't want you if you belong to another club - some of the dual members really have done a lot for USA - just look at the lifetime membership list that bailed them out of the tax lien and if that had not happened, there would have been no USA. You think I sound a little upset, think what they feel.
Also go see Larry Pinkston's post on the Final Tought thread. I am not making this up. Here is another good example. Maybe other regions do alot better with participation.
OGBS - send me or post your website and show me your non-profit status etc. If your organziation is not a joke and for supporting you personally, meaning its legit, I would be happy to send you something. :)
I've got 20 dogs (some rescues) of my own, plus 18 cats (rescues), chickens and horses of my own to support, but when I have it happy to help a good cause out for animals. Also, I do not sell or give any animals away.
by snajper69 on 11 November 2009 - 15:11
What's wrong with charging for parking if you there to watch. It cost money and a lot of work to put up a trial, why club should not try to make some money for equipment, seminar's for it's club members? Nothing wrong with that if you ask me,.
by Mystere on 11 November 2009 - 15:11
I have also donated lots of money to clubs for club, regional and national events. I have also donated time and effort/ that is simply part of being involved in the sport-period.
I have paid for parking or admission to NATIONAL events at times. Usually, it is simply admission and parking is free. At most, I have paid ~$10 for admision to a WORLD Championship. I have NEVER paid for parking oer admission to a CLUB trial. Frankly, I find that stunning. Only one club in my region (and I include British Columbia, Canada) charges to spectate at its club trials. It is the one club between the California border and far North BC that I have never attended...because it charges.
Most clubs welcome the support inherent in attending and do nothing to discourage it. It seems to me that a $10 parking charge has the effect of discouraging attendance, intentionally/unconsciously, or not. ...and people complain about the high parking rates in Seattle! :-)
by gucci on 11 November 2009 - 15:11
What is strange to me, is your dog has to join also, just more money spent.
by Kim Gash on 11 November 2009 - 17:11
Nia is one of the best financial supporters around and she donates heavily of her time and $. If Nia were a dual member, I know her sensibilites and feelings would be hurt and for lack of a better word, feel insulted if she were told where she could spend her money, all the while giving the biggest portion or time and money to USA. And there are other people like Nia. Nobody wants to be told they had no value when it's pretty obvious they had value.
USA is a dedicated group, no one is saying it is not. But when you are told no matter what good you have done, you are out, that's what strikes the bad chord.
On the parking - that's pretty funny. In the horse shows, we always had to pay for parking or it was included in a purchased exhibitors pass - no, I really have not seen it at any trial. I think there was one WDA trial in Florida where it was in a residential area, the neighbors were complaining and parking was limited, so the club did charge. Other than that I never heard of it either except at a national if it had to be that way.
My instance where I wish we could have manned the entrance was due to having it at Kansas Speedway in the centerfield and we did advertise. Because of people getting to be on a NASCAR infield and getting to look around, it did draw the general public, I think the dogs were just an added attraction!
USA is a dedicated group, no one is saying it is not. But when you are told no matter what good you have done, you are out, that's what strikes the bad chord.
On the parking - that's pretty funny. In the horse shows, we always had to pay for parking or it was included in a purchased exhibitors pass - no, I really have not seen it at any trial. I think there was one WDA trial in Florida where it was in a residential area, the neighbors were complaining and parking was limited, so the club did charge. Other than that I never heard of it either except at a national if it had to be that way.
My instance where I wish we could have manned the entrance was due to having it at Kansas Speedway in the centerfield and we did advertise. Because of people getting to be on a NASCAR infield and getting to look around, it did draw the general public, I think the dogs were just an added attraction!
by Kim Gash on 11 November 2009 - 18:11
Gucci - yes it is more costly with the USA requirement to register your dog to be able to show or get breed surveys - and honestly, before this amendment, I did not blink an eye at going ahead and paying it when I knew the only place I ever needed a USA registration was to show or breed survey at a USA club. That was just with my working dogs - I cannot immagine how onerous it is to pay for all the show dogs especailly at a Sieger show and regionals it is. Like Larry Plinkston said in his post, it just gets too expensive, then add in controversy, and it just does make you feel warm and fuzzy to whip out the old checkbook.
by OGBS on 11 November 2009 - 19:11
Kim,
We are most certainly 501c3 and have been for about 10 years. We are all volunteers (all 6 or 7 of us).
I, nor anyone else in my organization, receive a penny of the funds we get, which are almost entirely from adoptions. That money ($100 for cats/$150 for dogs) goes towards paying the veterinary expenses of spay/neuter, rabies shots, and micro-chipping (these three are state law), deworming, distemper shots and any other medical expenses which more often than not far exceed the adoption fee.
We are not big fundraisers and haven't even had any event of that sort for a couple of years. Too busy to plan one.
I work full time to support my hobbies of dog training, sailing, and, most importantly, rescueing homeless animals.
More than half in my group are cat rescuers only. I rescue both, but, prefer dogs. I like to take in the basket cases, those that are usually a day or two from being euthanized, mostly because the shelter doesn't have the funds or resources to care for them or rehab them. Many of the dogs I take are the dogs that the shelter volunteers are afraid of. I bring the dog in to my home and work with it to figure out its issues, usually relating to an abusive male and/or children, and then start rehabbing the dog. A lot of this involves getting the dog on some sort of daily schedule and allowing it to interact with my dogs. Abused and fearful dogs usually bond with other dogs more quickly than humans. The dog gets to see how I interact with my dogs and the relationship I have with them. I believe they pay close attention to this and it helps build trust with the dog. I work in some basic training, sits, downs, recalls, etc, house and crate train them and teach them that their life can be fun and positive and that they do not have to live in constant fear. When I feel they are capable of being placed I find them a home. Luckily, not all of the dogs I take in are this way. Some are happy litlle pups like the 6 month old I presently have. He shows minimal signs of abuse and he quickly learned that it wouldn't be that way with me. He is one of the lucky ones. I also help friends in the GSD world that need help placing dogs that they might have rescued, or, breeder returns, etc.
It can be a lot of work, but, I enjoy it.
www.ppah.petfinder.com
We are most certainly 501c3 and have been for about 10 years. We are all volunteers (all 6 or 7 of us).
I, nor anyone else in my organization, receive a penny of the funds we get, which are almost entirely from adoptions. That money ($100 for cats/$150 for dogs) goes towards paying the veterinary expenses of spay/neuter, rabies shots, and micro-chipping (these three are state law), deworming, distemper shots and any other medical expenses which more often than not far exceed the adoption fee.
We are not big fundraisers and haven't even had any event of that sort for a couple of years. Too busy to plan one.
I work full time to support my hobbies of dog training, sailing, and, most importantly, rescueing homeless animals.
More than half in my group are cat rescuers only. I rescue both, but, prefer dogs. I like to take in the basket cases, those that are usually a day or two from being euthanized, mostly because the shelter doesn't have the funds or resources to care for them or rehab them. Many of the dogs I take are the dogs that the shelter volunteers are afraid of. I bring the dog in to my home and work with it to figure out its issues, usually relating to an abusive male and/or children, and then start rehabbing the dog. A lot of this involves getting the dog on some sort of daily schedule and allowing it to interact with my dogs. Abused and fearful dogs usually bond with other dogs more quickly than humans. The dog gets to see how I interact with my dogs and the relationship I have with them. I believe they pay close attention to this and it helps build trust with the dog. I work in some basic training, sits, downs, recalls, etc, house and crate train them and teach them that their life can be fun and positive and that they do not have to live in constant fear. When I feel they are capable of being placed I find them a home. Luckily, not all of the dogs I take in are this way. Some are happy litlle pups like the 6 month old I presently have. He shows minimal signs of abuse and he quickly learned that it wouldn't be that way with me. He is one of the lucky ones. I also help friends in the GSD world that need help placing dogs that they might have rescued, or, breeder returns, etc.
It can be a lot of work, but, I enjoy it.
www.ppah.petfinder.com
by hodie on 11 November 2009 - 20:11
I will second Kim's post about Nia. She has contributed countless hours to USCA and I personally am aware of her generosity and kindness to many, whether specifically Schutzhund related activities or not. She is one who has put her money where her mouth is.
For what it is worth, I too have done GSD rescue, for more than 15 years now, and on very, very few donations. Only three donations in all those years were from anyone associated with Schutzhund. Most people involved in the sport prefer to suggest that rescue is not about "good dogs", but about the mutts. It isn't so. There are plenty of Schutzhund types, and show lines who end up in rescue. And in my experience, though many breeders say they will take a dog back, that too is BS. They don't. Unfortunately, for now, I cannot accept any additional dogs, even though I get many requests per month to do so. The economy has not been kind.
As for USCA, I am very sorry to hear that they will loose good clubs and people like Yvette if that too is true. She has definitely made a huge contribution to the magazine and to the organization, as several clubs mentioned here, and my own made to the organization. It is a shame that the organizations' leaders did not think about the real issues here and how offensive so many would find being dictated to as to what organization one can belong to or not. Of course, it is fine for them, the organization or judges to belong to a lot of different groups, some of which may not have the interests of USCA at the forefront. But again, they don't seem to care about that.
It is likely that nothing will come of protests, but the dollars and most importantly, the efforts of those who care, will go elsewhere. Human resources are the MOST important of all resources in an organization. In my opinion, it is too bad that USCA has consistently devalued that resource.
For what it is worth, I too have done GSD rescue, for more than 15 years now, and on very, very few donations. Only three donations in all those years were from anyone associated with Schutzhund. Most people involved in the sport prefer to suggest that rescue is not about "good dogs", but about the mutts. It isn't so. There are plenty of Schutzhund types, and show lines who end up in rescue. And in my experience, though many breeders say they will take a dog back, that too is BS. They don't. Unfortunately, for now, I cannot accept any additional dogs, even though I get many requests per month to do so. The economy has not been kind.
As for USCA, I am very sorry to hear that they will loose good clubs and people like Yvette if that too is true. She has definitely made a huge contribution to the magazine and to the organization, as several clubs mentioned here, and my own made to the organization. It is a shame that the organizations' leaders did not think about the real issues here and how offensive so many would find being dictated to as to what organization one can belong to or not. Of course, it is fine for them, the organization or judges to belong to a lot of different groups, some of which may not have the interests of USCA at the forefront. But again, they don't seem to care about that.
It is likely that nothing will come of protests, but the dollars and most importantly, the efforts of those who care, will go elsewhere. Human resources are the MOST important of all resources in an organization. In my opinion, it is too bad that USCA has consistently devalued that resource.
by Bob McKown on 11 November 2009 - 21:11
hodie:
What is the real issue here? I have my idea but i would like someone to put it in words.
I feel the real issue is that several times now USA has extended it,s self to the WDA and GSDCA in terms of working together and each time they have gotten pretty words at first then stuck in the back for the effort so when USA made overtures to WDA about combining it was fine till the GSDCA got the 2013 WUSV and figured out they have never put on a venue of this magnitude so now GSDCA and WDA are hand in hand again and USA again has nothing to show for it,s efforts. So I can understand the feeling that USA wants no one associated with the organization in any way contributing to the success of the 2013 event ?. If there going to do it why help them we got no contribution from GSDCA other then a couple team members so fair is fair. as childish as it sounds I understand that reason. To me it,s drawing a line in the sand something that needed done along time ago with another german organization in my opinion. Is that the reason ? I,d like to know any ones opinion other then the grandstanding of the rich and powerful and the show enthusiasts.
What is the real issue here? I have my idea but i would like someone to put it in words.
I feel the real issue is that several times now USA has extended it,s self to the WDA and GSDCA in terms of working together and each time they have gotten pretty words at first then stuck in the back for the effort so when USA made overtures to WDA about combining it was fine till the GSDCA got the 2013 WUSV and figured out they have never put on a venue of this magnitude so now GSDCA and WDA are hand in hand again and USA again has nothing to show for it,s efforts. So I can understand the feeling that USA wants no one associated with the organization in any way contributing to the success of the 2013 event ?. If there going to do it why help them we got no contribution from GSDCA other then a couple team members so fair is fair. as childish as it sounds I understand that reason. To me it,s drawing a line in the sand something that needed done along time ago with another german organization in my opinion. Is that the reason ? I,d like to know any ones opinion other then the grandstanding of the rich and powerful and the show enthusiasts.
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