stringing dog up - Page 4

Koehler did not say to hold the dog till it passes out...   I have three of his books.
And this had nothing to do with a fearful dog.

Sitasmom,

that is the suggestion for a dog who attempts to bite the handler, so we can conclude that this dog has not had respect for the handler instilled into him.  Koehler does not recomend that if you have a problem dog, you read the section of his book pertaining to your dog's problem and begin training at that point.  respect for the handler through basic training should be first.

Kczaja, I agree with your post and you make some excellent points.  Muzzles are great, we work with them all of the time.  However, you don't always have a muzzle on the dog.  I was  talking about hard, rank, dominant, confident, aggressive dogs that can do real damage.  If it comes to defending yourself you need various tools to do it.  I am not recommending stringing up dogs, I don't really like it but I like getting nailed less.  Like I said earlier  I've only had to do it a couple of times over the years, never to the point of unconsciousness.   And the dog does learn form the experience.

Jim

Rainforest Scouts,,
I said Leerburg -and I said online video-and he does say "until he passes out".

.



Slamdunc, thanks, I am going to try the tobasco sauce tomorrow! I sent you a PM

Katrina

"intrigued by your post, I retrieved my copy of "The Koehler Method of Dog Training" and quickly searched for the section wherein a trainer was advised to cause his dog to pass out cold. I will contiue to look for it, but so far the closest thing I can find is Koehler's suggestion that a "real hood", i.e. a handler aggressive dog, "should be suspended until he has neither the strength nor inclination to renew the fight." When he is lowered to the ground, he will "probably stagger loop-legged for a few steps, vomit once or twice, and roll over on his side." "

Here's the part from Koehler that follows "roll over on his side:"

"The sight of a dog lying, thick-tongued, on his side is not pleasant, but do not let it alarm you."

Sounds like a passed out dog to me. (When people are hung to execute them, the tongue becomes quite thick and protrudes from the mouth as the person suffocates.)

"Koehler is careful to mention at the beginning of his book that some of the more extreme methods in his book are reserved for last chance dogs."

Are they? He recommends hanging a dog for grabbing the leash:

“Lock both hands onto the leash . . . and lift straight up. . . . ‘Clear off the ground?’ you ask? Yup--until he longs so fervently for Mother Earth that he’d hardly invite another ‘lifting’ by grabbing the leash again.” (pp. 35-36 of the 1996 edition).

I don't know any dogs in danger of being euthanized for leash grabbing.

Also, I can't imagine why anyone would use the Koehler method of stopping a dog from chewing instead of just crating the dog when he's unsupervised:

“select a piece of the material he has chewed . . . and place it well back, crossways, in his mouth. Use a strip of adhesive tape to wrap the muzzle securely in front of the chewed material, so that no amount of gagging and clawing can force it from his mouth. Perhaps you are wondering if these frantic efforts to rid himself of the material will cause the dog to scratch himself painfully. Yup. They surely will.” (p. 166 of the 1996 edition).

This one is really dangerous--if the dog vomits, he is likely to suck the vomit into his lungs and die.

There are also better ways to stop barking than the Koehler method:

"“equip yourself with a man’s leather belt or strap heavy enough to give your particular dog a good tanning. Yup--we're going to strike him. Real hard. . . . lay the strap vigorously against his thighs. Keep pouring it on him until he thinks it’s the bitter end.” (pp. 168-169 of the 1996 edition)

Nor would I recommend the Koehler method of stopping a dog from chasing and biting bikes:

"Give him about five minutes of the hardest tanning you can administer. Use a belt heavy enough to make him really feel your efforts." (p. 172 of the 1996 edition)

And then there's the Koehler method for stopping a dog from digging:

“fill the hole to its brim with water. . . . bring the dog to the hole and shove his nose into the water; hold him there until he is sure he’s drowning. . . . fill the hole with water and repeat the experience the next day, whether the dog digs any more or not.” (pp. 178-179 of the 1996 edition)

There's more of this sicko stuff, but I think the point is clear.

Contrary to what Koehler thought, torture is not the only alternative to death when dealing with a misbehaving dog.

and some people have a problem with having a dog live outside in a kennel, and others will tell you that their dog will never stay in a crate.  some will never use a choke chain, pinch collar, or e-collar. 

forgot who made the commet about internet trainers, but it was good info.

seems we are headed to a dead end street called " agree to disagree"

john

my dad once "strung up" a high school kid who took a swing at him as a teacher.  he grabbed him by the throat and pinned him against a locker.  arguably, the kid may have lost some brain cells.  but afterward he would sit on command.

Many many of us were weaned on the Koehler method of training ions ago......99% of these people have modified their approach as time and objectives changes.......few of us have forgot the value of the learning experience and have a point of reference in passing judgements on these methods. Some of these methods I will still employ as a last ditch effort(which is very seldom these days), but methodology in training is always based on the individual dog presented. For some people their training techniques are limited, but the spectrum of types of temperaments and behavoirs are across the board....I find all the methods I have learned over the years have a place in my bag depending on dog and degree of severity of behavoir.