Frustrated..need help finding a pup - Page 4

 Ulli,

Your reputation here is safe and you are highly respected. Some of us who have been here for a while understand the "games" going on. This guy has no clue. I would suggest people steer clear of him or I guarantee he will be back soon complaining that the pup he bought is not what he wanted. Enough said? And no Mystere, he just has a habit of wasting time when trying to buy dogs, find a place to get training for them etc. But, he has a mountain of good excuses.....

Some of the posters here are relatively new and some are just plain naive. I have a litter now, a very nice litter, but I will be extremely picky in where these pups go. IF I agree to sell a pup to someone, then they will have to put up or shut up.....simple as that. I will not hesitate to sell a dog to someone else if the original buyer does not follow through on his/her end of the deal.

Sometimes the way people are approached or answer questions is indicative of a future positive or negative experience. Experience and gut should rule these encounters. As for breeders, there are some who are not ethical or honest. But, don't kid yourselves, there are also some buyers out there that are loosers, waste time, and have no clue what they really want,. If a breeder does not know how to separate those kind of people out from others, it means trouble, even for reputable, fair and honest breeders.

As for Ulli, if I wanted one of his pups, I would not hesitate to fulfill his conditions, nor he mine or tell me he could not.

Yvette, that's the only way to run a  business, unless you acually want to go under. People will never surprise when it comes to backing out.

 Yvette,

After holding boarding space for prime dates two Christmases ago for two separate people who did not even have the courtesy then to call and cancel, I require a NON-REFUNDABLE 50% deposit for holidays, even from my best clients. One cannot run a business waiting for people who ask you to special order bikes, for example, and who then leave you hanging. Nor can a kennel or any business run that way. People are fickle.....at least most are. Sadly, one must protect oneself and business.

Hello again All,

Thanks again to those who responded to what this thread was actually about (both good and bad responses). I'll just say a couple quick things to hopefully clear up some things being said....

1. I NEVER faulted Ulli or anyone for not holding the pups. I NEVER said he did anything wrong. Why would comments as such be made? As you can see from my posts I never mentioned ANYONE by name good or bad as far as a breeder was/is concerned. I agree they should sell to who and when they want. It is their perogative. I trust Ulli and admit I did take a bit too long to decide as I was evaluating more than 1 litter and wanted to do my homework and will NOT apologize for that. However I am sorry if Ulli took it that way and somehow felt I was a victim of his. I do not feel that way at all and in fact think Ulli is an honest upstanding person and do not fault him at all for my lack of timing and have even previously stated the same. Amazing how people can take something and run with it. WOW!

2. The REAL point of my thread was in a nutshell to get an understanding of the usual protocol when buying a pup and possibly a few referrals which I have received and are following up on. I just wanted to do the right thing as far as buying and hopefully reasonable for myself as well as the seller. ( see my earlier posts)

Again I didn't mean to start all this drama I simply wanted some idea of the usual protocol so I would know what to expect and what not to expect. If you knew me personally you would know I am not anywhere as difficult to get along with as a few of these posts might suggest.. Again I wasn't meaning for all this other to happen. I simply wanted some guidance and I got it. Good and bad.

Again I apolgize to ANYONE who may have taken my post for anything other than its intent as I am not out to cause drama with anyone either directly or indirectly and never would and especially not on a dog forum.

Thanks again and take care,

Sportsfan

Dan

Ulli

         As far as I am concerned you have nothing to worry about you did the right thing. Sportsfan putts around so you sold your pup's to someone else.  If I was a breeder I would do the same exact thing. From what I can tell you have an excellent reputation.

But you have to be really nieve as to what goes on here at this forum on a daily basis.  Buyers using this forum as a last resort to get breeders to do what they said they would do.  Buyers suing breeders going to all other legal means to get the breeders to live up to their own contracts. Their are so many incidents on here that it will make your head spin

There are a lot of excellant breeders on this forum like you and hodie but in my opinion from what I see what goes on here on this forum you are the exception to the rule. Buyer beware is the rule of the day.

Dan,

I thought I explained why I wrote what I wrote. The way you started this thread made me believe that it was directed at me, without mentioning my name. Due to the WWW, this world of ours has become rather small and a lot of gossip is spout out on the Net. So that is the reason why I believe that one should fend off, at the very start.

As for you wanting me to edit my post, I am sorry, but I wont. I never insulted or intimidated you and I wont in the future. All I mentioned was that I did a little research, and that is puplic knowledge and readily avaible for anyone who takes the time to look for it. It is most certainly not like I was engaging in a conspiracy or anything like it.

It may very well be, that I did, due to my limited english, took your starting post a little too serious, but that is the way I did understand it. And this is the last time that I will respond to this.

Best Regards

Larry,

yup, you are right, the bashing & smiring on here is something I do not wish to be a part of. As you said, buyers sueing breeders, breeders sueing buyers......... we have it all right here. I dont know, what happened to good old " One man, one word" ?? What happened to beeing resonable and willing to find solutions, that both partys can live with ?

Belive me, I too had my fair share of this crap, the only thing that keeps me going is my love to the breed & the joy I get out of breeding and last, but not least, the friends I make all over this globe ! Now that is a bonus that is truely priceless.

<The REAL point of my thread was in a nutshell to get an understanding of the usual protocol when buying a pup>

Buyer inquires, breeder lets them know what they have available.  A good breeder will do a referral to someone else if they don't have what you are looking for but know where you can get it.  If the breeder has a suitable pup for the buyer a screening process occurs from both sides.  Buyer makes an appointment to see the pup(s) and places a deposit if the pup isn't ready.  The deposit should be nonrefundable (elsewise, why bother).  Buyer pays the balance and picks up the pup when it's ready to go home.

If the litter cannot be seen because of distance constraints, photos, videos and candid conversations about temperaments and drives can be helpful.  The breeder should be willing to give a 3-5 day inspection (if shipping and buyer pays all related shipping costs).

The hardest part is finding the breeder you want to work with.  If you find them, be prepared to wait.  You MUST speak  with their vet as a reference.  Their vet knows what really goes on with the kennel (adults and pups). 

I sold a pup to a vet Saturday and a woman who manages a different vet clinic bought one yesterday.  Both people have knowledge of other GSD breeders who take their dogs into their respective clinics, and would never buy from any of them.  That speaks VOLUMES about the quality of the dogs they offer and or the ethics involved.  Ask the breeder's vet, "Would you buy one of their dogs if you were looking for a German Shepherd?"  Go on the answer from there.

What are your criteria in looking for a pup?  Does your budget match your expectations?  If not, consider rescue.  What has gone wrong that you haven't been able to find your pup? 

Ulli

       I hope a lot of breeders read your last comments to me.You are a credit to all breeders.I wish there were more breeders like you around.  A tip of my cap to you.

Larrydee,

the sad part about is, I really mean what I am saying ! Many a times peopel will tell you the vary same thing, and afterwords present you a bill. Anyhow, when I have the feeling & contact that it will benifitt our breed, I will most certainly do so for the benefit of our breed. I spend around 25.000 €uros in the last 6 month to a make sure I do everything right. Tell me how I wll make a profit with 1 litter a year, and I will personally award you with an Oscar !! I am not mad or sad that I did invest that kind of money, I am glad & thankfull that I was able to do so. And yes, it is great to get reponses from Puppy buyers.... just got one from NC :

Betty vom Sankt Martiner Tal, CGC,RA ...... what ever that excacly means, I am very proud of Allison & Betty !

All the best Ulli

Dan,  Have to say I am curious. Hodie asked you a question "what happened to your other dogs" which you have conveniently ignored. Got me looking.

Above you state " prefer the sire to be VA rated or at least top V. The Dam also has to be of proven lineage. I prefer for the male pup a dark blk/red and no white. ". Remarkably 3 years ago you used this exact phase including the "no white" part (wh/ suggests prior experience - its not something I would put in my description) EXCEPT you were talking about a female not a male. Then later you told the board you had found the puppy/breeder of your dreams.

The pup - Pisa vom Stieglerhof DOB 11/21/2004. Entered in 2005 USA Sieger show but absent,but not shown. I see no BH results , no Sch trial results, no shows American or German style, no Koer report. no OFA, no ZW therefore no "a" stamp .

So Dan perhaps  you could answer Hodie's question. What happened to your other dogs? Many breeders would want to know before selling you a pup.