The decline of the German Shepherd character - Page 36

I would far rather the US WL breeders aimed at what is coming out of

Germany today, for all its overangulation / hingeing / nerve failure

- as seen in SOME, not all,examples - than try to bring in the AKC

'Standard' SL construction.

This thred sometimes reads like posters cannot distinguish between

AKC SL, and SV SL.

Is there a written standard for it?

you mean the standard that's been repeatedly changed to accommodate egregious violations to the previous version ?

Do I hear some saying "who cares"?

yes. the entire SV SL judges collective, its governing body, breeders, and owners insisting that 67 cm - 65 cm equals zero.

Do I hear some saying "I know better"?

yes. anybody who completed 1st grade and didn't attend the SL brainwashing summer camp will tell you that 67cm -65 cm  != 0 

Do I hear some saying "since SV can make modification I can too"?

yes. if the SV can decree 67 - 65 = 0 and dogs have multiple attempts to complete a ridiculously watered down TSB test, why not. heck, at least the good folks from the RSV2000 can command simple arithmetic.

Do I hear some saying " my GSD is much better than what standard describes"?

this very question illustrates just how much you're missing the point.

walter martin ... dude, get over it. he was a delusional money-grubbing tyrant who luckily failed to drag a significant number of breeders with him to the bottomless abyss of sick, dumb, and otherwise useless black and tan couch covers not even closely resembling a herding dog even remotely capable of tending, guarding, and protecting -- trotting or otherwise. 

Haz, what else can that dog do? A frame? Palisade? Tend? Herd? OB? Very convincing bitework. I'd like to see him doing something else and I'd like to see a photo of him standing naturally. He appears to have plenty of angulation on both ends, and is not a small dog by any means. I like it that he is such a great family pet, but allowing a kid to ride him like a horse might demonstrate the dog's good nature, but that may not be the best thing for the dog's longterm well being. 

Blitz be real, do you really need to SEE that dog do a neat sit to convince you it can be trained to do a neat sit? do you really think that dog displayed any suggestion that it would not be capable of going over an A-frame or a pallisade.

ok tending & herding is different, who knows, the GSD is generally an embarrasment in that dept so lets not ask to see that, my guess it might not look pretty.

Hundmutter, I'm going to stick my neck out here and say that I am probably one of the very few members of this board who goes to shows and trials to watch workinglines and  German and American showlines. Trust me, the ASL or no worse off phenotypically than the GSL. If if you ever are able to open that video I sent you, look at both and get back to me. The tendence on the net seems to be to use the best GSL's to compare to the worst of the ASL and vice versa, not apple to apples by any stretch. It would be so nice to be able to put it all on the ASL breeders, gawd wouldn't that be great fun. However, it's not reality. Both are greatly in need of improvement in this area of the US and the workinglines I see here aren't so wonderful either. The entire breed is in need of help IMO.

vk, first I wasn't talking to you and secondly, yes, I want to see him doing something else other than biting. GSD's are not intended to be one trick ponies and I'm in  a learning curve where i want to see versatile GDS's, not dogs that can only do one thing - bite.  Since when aren't GSD's good at herding and tending. Have you ever seen an HGH trial. Have you ever heard of White Clover Farms? They might suck at it in Oz, but in the US and Germany they do very well.

So is it OK with you if I ask Haz some questions without your interjecting another of your argumentive comments?  Let's do it this way, if I want your opinion, I'll ask for it. Otherwise, buzz off. I can't put it any more politely than that.

Also Blitzen, it is easier and headache free to put it all on Walter Martin and hide our heads in the sand, he was the devil and we are the Angels 

The more we criticize the show GSD isn't the better work GSD becomes, no Sir

blitz yr getting irrational again, if you want a private conversation with Haz then pm otherwise deal with it.

since when aren't gsd good at herding, since the only herding that the vast maajority do is for symbolic, token or trial purposes.

if they were any good at it, they would be used for it in places like OZ where they herd thousands of sheep every day with actual herding dogs that aren't gsd, go figure that one out.

i hope Nate comes along and gives you a lesson on all the things you think that one trick pony dog can't do, that would be aa hoot.

so where is the vid of yr dog again, doing anything at all?

I have just seen the latest video from Haz but he should please note there is NO tight inbreedin this dog.. Haz please note - The inbreed begins in the 6th generation and more so in the 7th generation.

The dog himself, Beschützer des Jägers von den Sportwaffen, certainly displays the willingness to bite which I like and is not put off by any roughing up. It is not clear from the video whether the opening bite was on command, the music was too loud even when turned down. The helper was making a casual approach when the dog made the attack. When sent to the hide the dog immediately took a bite before the helper moved. Not sure whether he responded on command to the out or reacted when the handler gently eased him back. Once again the sound was too loud. Later in the video the arm was fed to the dog. Pity that we did not see any quartering away from the hide to make the man stand still.

Anatomically he looks as though he has good proportions but from the video he looks as though he may top size and a little heavy. Super head displaying very masculine size and proportions. Strong pigmantation which I like. He is now 7 years old and was mated last year to Queen ze Stribrneho kamene who has no inbreed in the first four generations - the inbreed was in the 5^th,6^th and 7th generation.   Haz please refer to your comment “I am glad you did a 4-5 it must have been scary.. :-). My comments were simply that people who breed these dogs and have attitudes and a knowledge base similar to yours will continue to cause a decline in these dogs' workability.

Queen ze Stribrneho kamene produced a male Yōkai von den Sportwaffen who was born on the 29^th July 2014 and too young to get a really fair opinion on him.

Overall, from what I could see on the video, I was impressed by his type and willingness to work and one that I would consider if I had a female suitable for him. Good dog.

Mackenzie