Very low civil drive - Page 3

I was searching google and I found this, 

http://www.dpca.org/BreedEd/index.php/articles/34-behavior/101-definition-of-drives

So maybe "civil drive" better be named civil character trait !!! what you think?

To those who read the above article, which of the below are correct and which are false?

1. All breeds of dogs have same drives, some have them higher and some lower, but all breeds have them within.
2. Not all breeds have same character traits.
3. Individual dogs within a breed may have stronger character traits than others.
4. A certain character is what determines whether a dog can excell in a certain work/job.
5. Civil drive is actually a character trait not a true drive.
6. A good trainer is one who uses knowledge of basic drives in dogs in general to understand general dog behavior and tailors his training techniques for a certain dog based on that specific dog's character traits. 

Thank you very much Ibrahim for finding that article - it's a 'keeper'!
I've got one or two other such lists of definitions, but I reckon that
one is the clearest yet.   Though it still doesn't really help me work
out why Taz's Prey drive for a ball leaves him unmoved by actual
prey animals  LOL.

You are probably right that "civil" in this context is better described as
a 'character trait' than a 'drive' - although this author doesn't mention
'civil' dogs as such.

Your quiz:
My interpretation of the article is:
1    Probably true overall, but some of these factors are very low in
some breeds once you step outside "working breeds world".

2    For my money, ALL breeds can exhibit ALL the traits listed;
whether they do or don't manifest them is to do with the individual
dog, its genetic inheritance and its environment;  not its breed.

3    Undoubtably true.

4    Can I answer "Probably" rather than correct or false pls ?

5    Agreed.

6    Very much the truth.  Would that all trainers lived up to that.

It's a sort of a way for me to test my own perception rather than a "quiz" , but you know you can call it as you wish 

Hundmutter,

Based on the above article the answer is available; there are two different drives, one is Prey and another is Play, your pup has high play drive but low prey drive, here are the differences between both

1. Prey This is the desire to chase, grasp and subdue prey

2. Play This is the desire to have physical contact with the handler, family, or even other dogs. 

After some "theoretical" research I tend to conclude that civil drive as a term/expression came from trainers who wanted to differenciate between a dog who is sleeve oriented versus a dog who is oriented towards the human who either wears the sleeve or weras no sleeve. One tends to think the prey is the sleeve, the other recognizes the original real prey is the human. So maybe it's a trainer's term not an academic term afterall and it's related to training itself though it also relates to the type/character/genetic build of the dog. Am I being of wild imagination here?!!!!!!!

Aaawww, and I was so sure you were giving prizes LOL!

***********

Yes i thought of that;  reading the two drive definitions, that would seem AN
answer;  but its not really THE OBVIOUS answer.  Believe me if you could
see this little sod with his ball-on-rope, contact with ME is NOT what it is all
about for him.  I'm just the 'throwing machine' (like those things for tennis
practice - or flyball  ??).  The ball itself is his reward, his tug-toy ...

***********

Trainer's term for the opposite of 'equipment oriented" - yeah, works for me.

Also to ad to the confusion, professionals when testing puppies, test prey drive through playing with a puppy like throwing an object and watch if it'll catch the puppy's attention/interest and what action follows, so Play and Prey drives are not clearly distinguished/seperated. It's a moving ground subject, also articles/knowlegable/trainers views are not exactly the same, so one gets confused.

Ibrahim, I think you get it.  LOL You can't help being analytical is all...   And remember each expert is likely to be speaking to his specific needs.  For instance the ring sport dog and the K9 LEO, their handlers want different drives for a specific bite.  I think.... !

That was a very interesting article about drives, traits, characters etc. And Hundmutter, to clarify, I think the play drive involves engaging another dog into the same behavior. I don't know what to say about the ball/prey drive being the same thing except that is what everyone here told me. LOL    I never thought my dog would kill any real prey until he got those baby woodchucks. I do think the difference between them is that PLAY drive does not end in a fight to the death, only the defeat of the challenger. In PREY drive the dog wants a kill as a conclusion. 

I think your ball loving, prey driven dog just is very smart and knows he is not threatened by the ball and it surely does not taste better than what you put in his bowl. How old is your dog, by the way, sorry if you said so already? How about squirrels, your dog must love chasing them?  Just saying the word gets mine going and he has never actually caught one!

Bee - no, Taz does not chase squirrels either (whether Alien - looking or not,
tee-hee).  Dont forget I came from keeping him where the 'work' pack all went
after - and ate - rabbits all the time, so because there were loads around I
always expected that he would chase them too.  (And because my previous
bitch used to chase rabbits - until 1 big buck turned back and bit her nose LOL)

As an 18-mth old Taz had a few runs at the big flocks of Canada Geese we had
landing all the time;  but he never looked serious about catching one, let alone
killing it.  and he kinda grew out of bothering.  He barks at pigeons rattling out of
trees above his head  in the dark 'cos he has disturbed them,  but that's the extent
of it.

Like you I normally think of 'play' drive involving other dogs.  To show how much
ball drive he has, even in the presence of a playmate he'd rather chase his ball.
I accept that is partly becos I've used it as a training aid/reward [in addition to food];
but even so ...

I have always  - like, forever, from every source - understood that ball drive is 'prey'
rather than 'play'  (although noting the play/prey connection).  Always seemed that
way with every dog I've known, those who wouldn't go for prey (& play) seemed only
to have Defence (or rather Fear/Fight/Flight as in this Dobe Club article).  Until I got
Taz ...              PS He'll be 10, a week into December.