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by michael49 on 31 July 2009 - 17:07
moons,
I don't have any personal experience with it,but I've seen some dogs that ate it,no better or worse looking then dogs that were fed good on anyother kibble in my opinion.We might have something in common about our beliefs in dry dog food.I don't think paying a dollar a pound or more for it makes it any better then some of the cheaper foods.I think people will pay more for feed,just because it cost more so it should be better.I don't give a shit what anyone says,I don't base my feed on the cost,I just look at the dogs, thats all the avertisement that I need.I bought into that bs several years ago when eukanuba first hit the shelves,Had more money then brains back then.Fed it for a couple of months,picked up a bag of diamond one day,still a cheap food back then.Placed a bowl of each in a puppy pen with a litter of rottweiler pups the diamond was their choice.I feed pedigree now,24.99 for 52 lbs at tractor supply.You saw pictures of my dogs,what do you think.I still buy the ocassional bag of diamond extreme althelete feed it mixed with the pedigree to some high drive working line pups that I have.As stated above,I feed alot of venison scraps from the processers during hunting season,the dogs do great on.Great coats,snow white teeth,plenty of energy.If I had a walk in cooler,I would feed it year round,saves me a quite a few dollars in feed,and the dogs are in excellent condition .Its fun to watch pups tear at a neck,you'll seed the pecking order develope before your eyes.Moons,do you train in any dog sport,Myself I just do some obedience work and a little prey bite work with some friends,nothing formal,just a few rednecks having fun with their dogs.I get the impression that your an old school country boy like myself,am I correct?
I don't have any personal experience with it,but I've seen some dogs that ate it,no better or worse looking then dogs that were fed good on anyother kibble in my opinion.We might have something in common about our beliefs in dry dog food.I don't think paying a dollar a pound or more for it makes it any better then some of the cheaper foods.I think people will pay more for feed,just because it cost more so it should be better.I don't give a shit what anyone says,I don't base my feed on the cost,I just look at the dogs, thats all the avertisement that I need.I bought into that bs several years ago when eukanuba first hit the shelves,Had more money then brains back then.Fed it for a couple of months,picked up a bag of diamond one day,still a cheap food back then.Placed a bowl of each in a puppy pen with a litter of rottweiler pups the diamond was their choice.I feed pedigree now,24.99 for 52 lbs at tractor supply.You saw pictures of my dogs,what do you think.I still buy the ocassional bag of diamond extreme althelete feed it mixed with the pedigree to some high drive working line pups that I have.As stated above,I feed alot of venison scraps from the processers during hunting season,the dogs do great on.Great coats,snow white teeth,plenty of energy.If I had a walk in cooler,I would feed it year round,saves me a quite a few dollars in feed,and the dogs are in excellent condition .Its fun to watch pups tear at a neck,you'll seed the pecking order develope before your eyes.Moons,do you train in any dog sport,Myself I just do some obedience work and a little prey bite work with some friends,nothing formal,just a few rednecks having fun with their dogs.I get the impression that your an old school country boy like myself,am I correct?
by von sprengkraft on 31 July 2009 - 18:07
Humans and dogs differ on their thoughts of dog food. My dogs eat royal canin, 1 cup twice daily, and whatever else is hanging around...be it scraps, a possum or coon, which I don't want in my barn, or an occasional stupid cat (smart ones get to stay). Yelli doesn't think she has done a proper job raising pups unless she kills something appropriate for dinner. Yes, Michael. The pecking order is amazing!! I'm not cooking any food for my dogs....JMHO. I don't believe a dog misplaced in the wilderness ever turned a rabbit on a spit over a fire. I only give raw bones to my dogs. My rottie bitch eats the whole bone, doesn't stop till it is gone.
As for potatoes.....I had a czech import bitch, Bena od Volfu. I believe she was the only fat czech dog to enter the US. I was told, she would dig up potatoes from the family garden and eat them. If I was peeling potatoes, she would bark like a machine gun!! She would scoff down all the peelings. Of course, when she saw tomato plants, she believed balls were growing for her. We had a few come to Jesus meetings about that!! LOL Man, I loved that dog!!
I hear of so many dogs having loose stools. Not mine. They can eat or roll in anything!! I am the breeder of one dog who gets diarrhea. It seems to happen after he eats abundant amounts of standing rib roast. I tell his owner to bring me the rib roast. From time to time, dogs overeat. The system can only has so much capacity.
Debbie
As for potatoes.....I had a czech import bitch, Bena od Volfu. I believe she was the only fat czech dog to enter the US. I was told, she would dig up potatoes from the family garden and eat them. If I was peeling potatoes, she would bark like a machine gun!! She would scoff down all the peelings. Of course, when she saw tomato plants, she believed balls were growing for her. We had a few come to Jesus meetings about that!! LOL Man, I loved that dog!!
I hear of so many dogs having loose stools. Not mine. They can eat or roll in anything!! I am the breeder of one dog who gets diarrhea. It seems to happen after he eats abundant amounts of standing rib roast. I tell his owner to bring me the rib roast. From time to time, dogs overeat. The system can only has so much capacity.
Debbie
by Two Moons on 31 July 2009 - 18:07
Country boy, but without the attitude.
Then there was the sixties and seventies, a bit of a freak, I hate the word hippy, it just didn't apply, but I was there.
Now just Mr.Natural, I've learned what its all about and whats important, sometimes I forget.
I train my dogs in obedience on and off leash, we dabble with tracking and some agility, more for fun than anything else.
Now I'm just growing older wondering what will ache next. Wishing I had done so many things differently, but what the hell.
No real regrets.
I'll use the free samples, never look a gift horse in the mouth, but I'll stay with my steady brand and keep adding the little extras that make life worth living.
The dogs have always looked good and had plenty of energy.
I know that if I had to live off the land I would only have one dog, and we would fight over the bones....:)
I do feed venison in season but I also worm in the winter, food for thought.
Have a garden, raise something you can eat, and don't over use your resources. Take what nature offers but don't take it all. Right now its berries, then apples and peaches, later nuts. Some fishing but not a big fan, the hunting is getting harder due to disease and over hunting by neighbors and out of towners.
If everyone had to live off the land tomorrow, we would deplete our resources in a week and I'm in the middle of the National Forest.
Thats sad.
A country boy can survive, but only if he uses his head and can adapt.
Then there was the sixties and seventies, a bit of a freak, I hate the word hippy, it just didn't apply, but I was there.
Now just Mr.Natural, I've learned what its all about and whats important, sometimes I forget.
I train my dogs in obedience on and off leash, we dabble with tracking and some agility, more for fun than anything else.
Now I'm just growing older wondering what will ache next. Wishing I had done so many things differently, but what the hell.
No real regrets.
I'll use the free samples, never look a gift horse in the mouth, but I'll stay with my steady brand and keep adding the little extras that make life worth living.
The dogs have always looked good and had plenty of energy.
I know that if I had to live off the land I would only have one dog, and we would fight over the bones....:)
I do feed venison in season but I also worm in the winter, food for thought.
Have a garden, raise something you can eat, and don't over use your resources. Take what nature offers but don't take it all. Right now its berries, then apples and peaches, later nuts. Some fishing but not a big fan, the hunting is getting harder due to disease and over hunting by neighbors and out of towners.
If everyone had to live off the land tomorrow, we would deplete our resources in a week and I'm in the middle of the National Forest.
Thats sad.
A country boy can survive, but only if he uses his head and can adapt.
by michael49 on 31 July 2009 - 20:07
Sounds like we pretty much see things the same way,lot of things in common.berries,peaches,pretty much done here.Never really a hippy either,enjoyed some some of the benefits of the lifestyle though.De-worm the dogs regularly,especially when feeding wild raw food.Probably right about resource depletion,maybe not that fast,I think the poulation would decrease pretty fast also.I think a lot of folks don't know how to make do.Nothing wrong with folks buying high dollar dog food,if they can afford it,I can't.I love steak,shrimp,lobster,but its beans,potatoes,pork chops and such that I survive on,dogs have to eat like me[whats affordable] Otherwise we'd all have to skip some meals.Don't blame you about the science diet,I would just mix it with the regular untill it was gone.Wish you luck with your last pup,Good post about the unwanted,lot of interesting responses.I think I know why you did it, and I think you found out what you wanted to know.Never thought you were talking about your pup.
Michael
Michael
by Two Moons on 31 July 2009 - 20:07
Perhaps its my situation but now all of a sudden I'm thinking about Pork chops!
Damn.....
LOL......
The unwanted was on my mind because of all the recent talk about shelters over flowing, my vets been trying to get me to take a lab, and I went to my local animal shelter not long ago to see about a job they were offering.
And then I see one on the road, looking totally lost and alone.
It breaks my heart, much worst than I would feel doing whats right.
I not long ago saw a rerun about the Polar bears and lost habitat living in the dumps till the ice returned.
Doesn't matter why this has happened but it too is hard to take.
Not any worst than seeing whole families digging thru dumps in other parts of the world trying to survive.
So when Fluffy turns his nose up at fancy feast I say throw his ass in the trash can next feeding time.
BTW,
The dogs liked the Science diet, maybe because it was fresh and new, but the label didn't impress me.
These dogs will eat just about anything, I can't think of much they ever turned their noses at.
Damn.....
LOL......
The unwanted was on my mind because of all the recent talk about shelters over flowing, my vets been trying to get me to take a lab, and I went to my local animal shelter not long ago to see about a job they were offering.
And then I see one on the road, looking totally lost and alone.
It breaks my heart, much worst than I would feel doing whats right.
I not long ago saw a rerun about the Polar bears and lost habitat living in the dumps till the ice returned.
Doesn't matter why this has happened but it too is hard to take.
Not any worst than seeing whole families digging thru dumps in other parts of the world trying to survive.
So when Fluffy turns his nose up at fancy feast I say throw his ass in the trash can next feeding time.
BTW,
The dogs liked the Science diet, maybe because it was fresh and new, but the label didn't impress me.
These dogs will eat just about anything, I can't think of much they ever turned their noses at.
by DDR-DSH on 01 August 2009 - 00:08
Keepthefaith, I loved seeing the recipe!!!
I will try it, too!
I also really enjoyed the other great stories, memories and personal experiences! Thanks, all!!!
I will try it, too!
I also really enjoyed the other great stories, memories and personal experiences! Thanks, all!!!
by michael49 on 01 August 2009 - 02:08
I also enjoyed this thread very much.Thanks to everyone Michael
by Slamdunc on 01 August 2009 - 04:08
Keepthefaith,
Your dog would do better if you didn't debone and cook the chicken. Feed the chicken and chop meat raw, blanch the vegetables and put them in a food processor or blender. Don't boil the veggies it removes too many nutrients. Dogs can not digest vegetables unless they are pureed. You need to break the cell wall down. Dogs also don't utilize carbohydrates like people do. Dogs actually don't need carbs, so the rice is just a filler. Fat is the energy source for dogs not carbs.
I feed my dogs a raw diet similar to what you have described only raw. Dogs do not get salmonella or ecoli when eating a strictly raw diet of fresh food. DDR-DSH is actually not accurate on this post regarding a dogs digestive system and raw food and salmonella.
Problems arise when you mix raw and kibble. A dogs digestive system is virtually identical to a wolf's.
KTF, what you are feeding is infinitely better that dry dog food but could be improved, IMHO. I feed my dogs 2 - 4 % of their body weight in raw food each day depending on age, activity and condition. My police K9 eats about 2 1/2 lbs of raw food each day. It consists of chicken quarters (bones and all), chop meat, beef heart or liver, yogurt, cottage cheese, an occasional egg and pureed veggies. I add the egg once a week and veggies 2 - 3 times a week. My 10 year old female eats 1 1/2 lbs of raw food each day, same as above. She is vibrant and full of energy, she still tracks does OB in drive and looks great. I don't do any bite work with her any more. She acts like a 5 year old dog. Her blood work was down recently and the vet was amazed at how good it was. I have gotten the cost down to about a $1 a lb of food.
JMO and experience,
Jim
Your dog would do better if you didn't debone and cook the chicken. Feed the chicken and chop meat raw, blanch the vegetables and put them in a food processor or blender. Don't boil the veggies it removes too many nutrients. Dogs can not digest vegetables unless they are pureed. You need to break the cell wall down. Dogs also don't utilize carbohydrates like people do. Dogs actually don't need carbs, so the rice is just a filler. Fat is the energy source for dogs not carbs.
I feed my dogs a raw diet similar to what you have described only raw. Dogs do not get salmonella or ecoli when eating a strictly raw diet of fresh food. DDR-DSH is actually not accurate on this post regarding a dogs digestive system and raw food and salmonella.
Problems arise when you mix raw and kibble. A dogs digestive system is virtually identical to a wolf's.
KTF, what you are feeding is infinitely better that dry dog food but could be improved, IMHO. I feed my dogs 2 - 4 % of their body weight in raw food each day depending on age, activity and condition. My police K9 eats about 2 1/2 lbs of raw food each day. It consists of chicken quarters (bones and all), chop meat, beef heart or liver, yogurt, cottage cheese, an occasional egg and pureed veggies. I add the egg once a week and veggies 2 - 3 times a week. My 10 year old female eats 1 1/2 lbs of raw food each day, same as above. She is vibrant and full of energy, she still tracks does OB in drive and looks great. I don't do any bite work with her any more. She acts like a 5 year old dog. Her blood work was down recently and the vet was amazed at how good it was. I have gotten the cost down to about a $1 a lb of food.
JMO and experience,
Jim
by keepthefaith on 01 August 2009 - 15:08
DDR-DSH, glad you found the recipe helpful.
A few additional tips you may wish to consider:
I discard the broth that remains after chicken is boiled. I do add some plain water to moisten the food. My male GSD is very sensitive to fat and gets diarrhea if there is any excess fat in his diet - so adding the broth would be asking for trouble. I also discard part of the skin from the chicken. Make sure you introduce the veggies gradually to the rice/chicken/ground beef mix. The veggies provide fiber and, again, until their system has adjusted, you may have problems if the full portion of veggies is introduced in one go. It takes about two hours to prepare ten days of feed for the dogs. I also give them a raw bone with a little meat and marrow (separately) to help meet their calcium requirements.
If your dogs are anything like mine, they will down their food like there is no tomorrow.
Jim (slamdunc), thanks for taking the time to share your experience and advice. Frankly, the only reason that I don't go with a raw diet is because we go away during the winter for three to four months at which time my the dogs move in with my daughter. I know that she would not stick with raw feeding - the whole idea of feeding raw is something that she finds off-putting. I actually had to make sure with her that she would be willing to continue the feeding program that the dogs are on now before I switched them from kibble. She does have help at home so the actual preparation of the food for the dogs is not something that will be burdensome.
The veggies are not boiled but steamed in order to minimize the loss of nutrients and then it is pureed. Your information about portion size was helpful - it confirmed what I read as I was researching the subject. Can you give me some guidance about how much cottage cheese to include?
Re the use of rice, I am hoping to gradually reduce its percentage in the recipe.
I wholly agree with you that kibble as a regular feed for dogs is something that is the least desirable option. I am even dubious about the higher quality kibble as a regular diet for dogs. Perhaps it is a case of my "humanizing" the needs of dogs but I do feel very comfortable knowing exactly what ingredients my dogs are eating. I'd love to feed more organ meat but in Northern Virginia where we live, it is quite expensive - quite a bit more than what it costs for the chicken quarters!
A few additional tips you may wish to consider:
I discard the broth that remains after chicken is boiled. I do add some plain water to moisten the food. My male GSD is very sensitive to fat and gets diarrhea if there is any excess fat in his diet - so adding the broth would be asking for trouble. I also discard part of the skin from the chicken. Make sure you introduce the veggies gradually to the rice/chicken/ground beef mix. The veggies provide fiber and, again, until their system has adjusted, you may have problems if the full portion of veggies is introduced in one go. It takes about two hours to prepare ten days of feed for the dogs. I also give them a raw bone with a little meat and marrow (separately) to help meet their calcium requirements.
If your dogs are anything like mine, they will down their food like there is no tomorrow.
Jim (slamdunc), thanks for taking the time to share your experience and advice. Frankly, the only reason that I don't go with a raw diet is because we go away during the winter for three to four months at which time my the dogs move in with my daughter. I know that she would not stick with raw feeding - the whole idea of feeding raw is something that she finds off-putting. I actually had to make sure with her that she would be willing to continue the feeding program that the dogs are on now before I switched them from kibble. She does have help at home so the actual preparation of the food for the dogs is not something that will be burdensome.
The veggies are not boiled but steamed in order to minimize the loss of nutrients and then it is pureed. Your information about portion size was helpful - it confirmed what I read as I was researching the subject. Can you give me some guidance about how much cottage cheese to include?
Re the use of rice, I am hoping to gradually reduce its percentage in the recipe.
I wholly agree with you that kibble as a regular feed for dogs is something that is the least desirable option. I am even dubious about the higher quality kibble as a regular diet for dogs. Perhaps it is a case of my "humanizing" the needs of dogs but I do feel very comfortable knowing exactly what ingredients my dogs are eating. I'd love to feed more organ meat but in Northern Virginia where we live, it is quite expensive - quite a bit more than what it costs for the chicken quarters!
by Slamdunc on 01 August 2009 - 22:08
KTF,
I add a couple of tablespoons of cottage cheese to my females food and about 3- 4 tablespoons to the males. I don't add it to every meal and I use the 4% fat kind not the low fat. I add yogurt regularly to their food. I also supplement with fish oil capsules and vitamin E.
I go sparingly with the veggies, when I do add them it's only a couple of tablespoons. The raw bones provide roughage and many essential nutrients. The raw bones are a key factor in my feeding. I have been trying Oma's pride and I really like their raw food diet. They incorporate tripe which I have trouble getting fresh around here. You only need to add small amounts of the organ meat as well. I bought 10 lbs of beef liver yesterday, which I will freeze and it will last me a couple of months. I have beef heart which I use in small amounts. I will add a raw egg, shell and all once or twice a week. Once you get the hang of it, feeding raw is not that difficult. You could feed the dogs raw while they are with you and your daughter could use your cooked recipe when she has them.
I even feed raw when I travel. I simply stop at the supermarket and buy fresh ingredients, I usually buy enough for a couple of days then go shopping again.
It does take more time then scooping kibble from a bag and it does cost a little more but I think it's worth it. I'm sure it will pay dividends on lower vet bills and increased health and longevity of my dogs. I've already seen a huge difference. I figure it costs me about $120 a month to feed 2 adult GSD's. I have no idea what a premium dog food would cost for these 2 dogs each month. It's been 3 years since I have bought dry dog food an I won't go back.
FWIW,
Jim
I add a couple of tablespoons of cottage cheese to my females food and about 3- 4 tablespoons to the males. I don't add it to every meal and I use the 4% fat kind not the low fat. I add yogurt regularly to their food. I also supplement with fish oil capsules and vitamin E.
I go sparingly with the veggies, when I do add them it's only a couple of tablespoons. The raw bones provide roughage and many essential nutrients. The raw bones are a key factor in my feeding. I have been trying Oma's pride and I really like their raw food diet. They incorporate tripe which I have trouble getting fresh around here. You only need to add small amounts of the organ meat as well. I bought 10 lbs of beef liver yesterday, which I will freeze and it will last me a couple of months. I have beef heart which I use in small amounts. I will add a raw egg, shell and all once or twice a week. Once you get the hang of it, feeding raw is not that difficult. You could feed the dogs raw while they are with you and your daughter could use your cooked recipe when she has them.
I even feed raw when I travel. I simply stop at the supermarket and buy fresh ingredients, I usually buy enough for a couple of days then go shopping again.
It does take more time then scooping kibble from a bag and it does cost a little more but I think it's worth it. I'm sure it will pay dividends on lower vet bills and increased health and longevity of my dogs. I've already seen a huge difference. I figure it costs me about $120 a month to feed 2 adult GSD's. I have no idea what a premium dog food would cost for these 2 dogs each month. It's been 3 years since I have bought dry dog food an I won't go back.
FWIW,
Jim
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