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by Carlin on 09 October 2013 - 18:10
Hund - the thread I was referring to was one of shtal's, Ark, or creation, something like that.
There is no doubt, that a large contingent of people of faith see the world through a particular world view, as you do through your own. Everyone inhabits a particular paradigm. In such a world, what becomes necessary for peace and cooperation while maintaining freedom/natural rights is the ability to engage on a level, leaving the baggage behind, for better or worse. I was born into Catholicism. By the time I was a young man, I rationally divorced myself from man's "religion", and walked the planet an atheist for years believing in nothing but the ground I stood on. That I believe whatever I do now, is not, and has never been the result of an inherited faith, any sort of ignorance, or fear of death or the unknown. I have lived in both camps, so I can appreciate both world views, and the prejudices that are native to each side. One of the issues I have with some atheists, is that they often make assumptions and generalizations about people of faith. The reason Sagan's "humility" may be so significant, is because it illustrates perfectly that our cosmic insignificance precludes us from "knowing" enough about "everything", to make casual assertions about "everything", to one end or another. I must respect that I will likely never be in a position to "prove God" to you, and I would hope to expect that you would respect that you will likely never be able to "disprove" a prime-mover to me. In a nutshell, that has been my position on such matters here in mixed company, though others seem to enjoy the inflammatory back-and-forth.
There is no doubt, that a large contingent of people of faith see the world through a particular world view, as you do through your own. Everyone inhabits a particular paradigm. In such a world, what becomes necessary for peace and cooperation while maintaining freedom/natural rights is the ability to engage on a level, leaving the baggage behind, for better or worse. I was born into Catholicism. By the time I was a young man, I rationally divorced myself from man's "religion", and walked the planet an atheist for years believing in nothing but the ground I stood on. That I believe whatever I do now, is not, and has never been the result of an inherited faith, any sort of ignorance, or fear of death or the unknown. I have lived in both camps, so I can appreciate both world views, and the prejudices that are native to each side. One of the issues I have with some atheists, is that they often make assumptions and generalizations about people of faith. The reason Sagan's "humility" may be so significant, is because it illustrates perfectly that our cosmic insignificance precludes us from "knowing" enough about "everything", to make casual assertions about "everything", to one end or another. I must respect that I will likely never be in a position to "prove God" to you, and I would hope to expect that you would respect that you will likely never be able to "disprove" a prime-mover to me. In a nutshell, that has been my position on such matters here in mixed company, though others seem to enjoy the inflammatory back-and-forth.
by Hundmutter on 10 October 2013 - 01:10
I get that; I hope you have not felt my 'contempt' directed AT YOU,
if so it wasn't intentional. It is there; but it is meant to be squarely
aimed at those christians - or indeed proponents of any religious
belief - who feel they have a right to jump on everybody else, dictate
what they should do / have faith in, worse, attack or kill someone eg
'cos they r a Doctor @ an abortion clinic; or generally expect the rest
of us to fall into line and accept society oughtta be run according to
their views & only theirs. I try not to generalise all christians as belonging
to that minority group.
As I explained, on here I feel my contempt has been EARNED by Shtal.
if so it wasn't intentional. It is there; but it is meant to be squarely
aimed at those christians - or indeed proponents of any religious
belief - who feel they have a right to jump on everybody else, dictate
what they should do / have faith in, worse, attack or kill someone eg
'cos they r a Doctor @ an abortion clinic; or generally expect the rest
of us to fall into line and accept society oughtta be run according to
their views & only theirs. I try not to generalise all christians as belonging
to that minority group.
As I explained, on here I feel my contempt has been EARNED by Shtal.
by vk4gsd on 10 October 2013 - 01:10
hund, have i earned yr contempt?
by Shtal on 10 October 2013 - 02:10
Hundmutter,
I am not going to say much in regards of your post or reply to carlin, cuz not worth my time, but I will only post two scriptures and I am done with this thread.
(KJV) Luke Chapter 21
15 For I will give you a mouth and wisdom, which all your adversaries shall not be able to gainsay nor resist.
17 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake.
Shtal.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
VK4 wrote: anyhoo, we can withstand, lol, you
Really, lol, How can I take you seriously if your great, great, great, great, great, great grandfather was a rock.
EDIT: You can't even explain to me how your grandfather became first living cell 4.6Billion years ago.
I am not going to say much in regards of your post or reply to carlin, cuz not worth my time, but I will only post two scriptures and I am done with this thread.
(KJV) Luke Chapter 21
15 For I will give you a mouth and wisdom, which all your adversaries shall not be able to gainsay nor resist.
17 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake.
Shtal.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
VK4 wrote: anyhoo, we can withstand, lol, you
Really, lol, How can I take you seriously if your great, great, great, great, great, great grandfather was a rock.
EDIT: You can't even explain to me how your grandfather became first living cell 4.6Billion years ago.
by vk4gsd on 10 October 2013 - 02:10
strange my bible is worded different;
15: for I will give you a mouth and wisdom which all your adversaries will not be able to withstand or to contradict.
i thought the inerrant word of god would be the same.....words???????
anyhoo, we can withstand, lol, you and contradict you by pointing out yr own contradictions.
and who is being adverse anyways, thought it was just banter???
15: for I will give you a mouth and wisdom which all your adversaries will not be able to withstand or to contradict.
i thought the inerrant word of god would be the same.....words???????
anyhoo, we can withstand, lol, you and contradict you by pointing out yr own contradictions.
and who is being adverse anyways, thought it was just banter???
by Carlin on 10 October 2013 - 11:10
Well said hund, and thank you.
by Two Moons on 10 October 2013 - 11:10
How many times has shtal said (I am done with this thread)?
Shtal,
no one here hates you or gouda, mostly they are repulsed, while some feel sorry for you.
Your ego maybe is telling you it's something else.
Shtal,
no one here hates you or gouda, mostly they are repulsed, while some feel sorry for you.
Your ego maybe is telling you it's something else.
by Hundmutter on 10 October 2013 - 16:10
How many times has Shtal told us he's 'out of here'
:OOOhhh, lemme see: about six hundred and sixty -odd times ?
Usually at least three times per topic thred.
VK4, no, Pete, or at least not for being offensively religious LOL
Actually I tend to agree with you more than I let on, usually;
just got a little pissed off with you for the "What could I possibly
learn from you " type remarks you've used occasionally !
by vk4gsd on 10 October 2013 - 18:10
"How many times has Shtal told us he's 'out of here' 
OOOhhh, lemme see: about six hundred and sixty -odd times ?"
try 666 to be exact.
"VK4, no, Pete, or at least not for being offensively religious"
i must be slipping
"What could I possibly learn from you " type remarks you've used occasionally !"
can't remeber the context TBH - guessing on one of the doggy forums which i have concluded are the least likely place to learn anything at all about dogs.
"
"
WOO-HOO
OOOhhh, lemme see: about six hundred and sixty -odd times ?"try 666 to be exact.
"VK4, no, Pete, or at least not for being offensively religious"
i must be slipping
"What could I possibly learn from you " type remarks you've used occasionally !"
can't remeber the context TBH - guessing on one of the doggy forums which i have concluded are the least likely place to learn anything at all about dogs.
"
"WOO-HOO
by Hundmutter on 11 October 2013 - 03:10
Don't get excited about the , I'm old enough to
be your mum, lol.
Re the mark of the beast - You got it ! [Wonder if Shtal did ?].
, I'm old enough tobe your mum, lol.
Re the mark of the beast - You got it ! [Wonder if Shtal did ?].
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