Von Erzengel Z littler Puppy with Major Genetic Defects - Page 20

P59, I have to revise my statement to say - I would immediately return a dog with obvious health issues. If the severity of those problems were downplayed by the breeder or if the breeder said - when the dog comes back I'm putting it down, then I'd probably keep it depending. Once it stayed here for a week or 2, I would never send it back and would cut my losses and move on.

I am at a loss as to why breeders require the return of a dog prior to resitution when there are so many other ways to affirm a diagnosis that does not require the return of the dog. Why do that? Seems to be an iron clad way to get out of honoring most contracts. Years ago when I worked as a tech a client came into the office with a brand new Saint puppy purchased at Doktor's Pet Center. She showed us the written guarantee and that dog was warranteed against anything you can think of. Long story short, the dog had severe HD at 6 months and the only way she could get any help from Doktor's was to return the puppy. She loved that damned dog by that time, opted to keep him and ended up with a raft of vet bills and dog who only survived for 3 years. Doktor's of course counted on that happeoning in most instances so they seldom had to refund on any dog over a few months of age.

Update on ZACH

Last night Zach was breathing really hard, and seemed to be glassy eyed.  We took him into united emergency.  The on duty vet  told us this was a classic case of bad breeding, she stated that the obvious outside irregularities would have been apparent at 8 weeks.  The vet told us that Zach did not have long, that he was not in pain but would pass any day. They are running a blood report and giving him fluids this morning.  They seem to think this is an inside issue, as his heart had an irregular beat, and not related to his hips and elbows. Another form of deformity.

She asked us if we wanted to put him, or take him home, since it would be soon.  We decided to take him home and both take a week off of work to be with him.  I can only pray that god with take him gently, and that this breeder will never put a family through this again. This is the 3rd Dr. who advised us that the defects would be apparent at 8 weeks, and we got Zach at 9 weeks.  We also had a local german shepherd breeder look at him, and they had the same opinion. 

Zach is family to us, and I can only hope that the AKC will pull the license of this breeder, it may not stop her, but we have to stand up for what is right, and protect others from this flagrant disregard for puppies. 

I just wish we could see all the medical and vet report.  This is a really strange situation.

IF you've been advised to put this dog down, why do you prolong it's agony?

When you were asked to return it 2 days after you got it, why didn't you?

It's unfortunate, but it's one bad pup, out of many great ones.  She has dogs working the streets in Texas, Alabama, Louisiana and God knows where else.  These dogs go out everyday, into communities, schools and on highways sniffing out drugs in an attempt to keep them off the streets and out of the hands of children.  She provides a great service and has many outstanding dogs.

If this pup is as bad as stated, it is unfortunate for him, but the breeder has made every effort to get this dog back and refund your money.  As hard as it may seem, sometimes, you just have to let go.

We have done everything we can do.  I do care about my dogs and my friends who buy them.  I care about everything.  That is why my whole life is about this.  My entire family works here and lives here. 

Anyway...  I have made the offer on a public forum many times.  We have no response.  I can do nothing now but say formally and publicly this client can not be satisfied.  We have exhausted all avenues to attempt to make this person happy and there is nothing which meets this criteria.

I am going to assume the continual refusal of the return of the pup as refusal for a settlement to this whole thing.  Therefore, I am now finishe with this client.  I can only hope that this pup is going to get some relief from all this IF it is indeed going on.

I have talked to my attorney and he said there is nothing more I can do.  She bought goods she believed to be defective and continued to keep them and alter them.  He is legally her property and her refusal of the aggreement of what would have to happen if she were unhappy with the dog is sufficient to close this case.

Think what you all want of me, good or bad.  But even a refund would not have stopped this woman from her rant and rave.  The attention is gratifiying and if she truly was unhappy on day 2 she should have returned the dog and accepted the refund as advertised.  She could not have had that much of an emotional bond to this dog after 48 hours.

And as for the vet and the German Shepherd Breeder who can look at this dog now and say with authority that this dog was like this at 8 weeks, I would like to see you prove that.  I have a photo of this dog in her home with her other dog within 3 days and you can judge for yourself.

Why in the world would I have shipped a pup that I thought was unhealthy?  $800???  no.

I am considering this matter closed and her constant refusal of refund is her final rejection.

End of story.

The female is to be spayed.  I can't take the chance that ANY of this she claims might be true.  The others are fine.

Malinda Julien

Archangel German Shepherds

There are many here like myself who are very concerned and a bit confused about the condition of the pup. Is it possible to give someone here the name of the vet so all of this can be confirmed? I'm just hoping the pup is getting the best care possible and money is not an issue.

I'm with k9cop5 with this one. Why do you choose to prolong this puppies agony. It's almost like you are feeding off of all this attention. Let me say that I had a 6month old female pup that was to be shown at one of the Sieger shows and her trainer and I felt it best to get her hips xrayed. Well long story short,  she was more than severely, severely dysplastic. She did not have a hip socket but you could not tell it by looking at her.  It's one of those deals where a friend trades you a pup for one of your pups. Well she was absolutely stunning and very loving. My first question to the vet was, what would you do (keeping in mind this is one of the vets  here in the Dallas/Ft. Worth area all the breeders use and is very well respected) he said, " you have to look at what quality of life this puppy will have in it's future". Well I came home crying so upset, not expecting this outcome. I immediatly called a friend, to console me, and then I took it upon my self to notify the breeder. She was in total shock but was so supportive and only asked one thing of me. Before I made the desicion to put my puppy down, please let her see the xrays my vet had taken, (again she knows this vet and his experience taking xrays) and wanted to send them to her vet and some breeder friends she had. I gave her that option, if she had asked I would have sent her the puppy (she bred this puppy and had a right to know what this breeding was producing) . A couple of days later she emailed me and said that all parties had agreed with my vet and to put her down as I had already planned. It was very agonizing to come to this decision, but I made it because I loved my puppy and did not want her to suffer anymore than she had to. Please just swallow your pride, stop trying to prove your point, we all understand where you are coming from, believe me even the breeders know. Just stop showcasing your puppies health issues and do what is right by your puppy.  You continue to make these allegations towards the breeder, she countless times  tries to make good on her word and yet you continue this saga. The bottom line is, if you love this puppy like you say, he is a member of the family and much loved, just please stop all this. SEND THE BREEDER THE PUPPY, LET HER PICK UP THE PUPPY, GIVE HER THE OPPORTUNITY TO SEE WHAT WENT WRONG.  IT'S NOT ABOUT THE MONEY ANYMORE, NOW YOU HAVE MADE IT ABOUT CAUSING AGONY LIKE YOUR OWN.  I for one would not want you to own one of my puppies knowing you would allow it to suffer for 6 months, that is not love to me. With every loving kiss your puppy has given you as he grows, you have let him down by dragging this on. You should be ashamed of yourself, obviously genetics played a huge role in this, and you should have sent him back on the next plane when you got him, but it's all about the money. I am just so disgusted with this whole situation, I just don't understand some people, it's not always about the breeder not wanting to do the right thing, it's about the clients that won't allow you to do the right thing.  Geez

Debbie

Very sad. Wish I lived closer so I could help these people out. I would never send the pup back to the breeder. I feel pretty helpless sitting here in the midwest.

I have been reading this post with utter disbelief for the past couple of days.  I hardly ever post on this site but just couldn't stand it any longer.  My husband and I bred GSD's for years and while we fortunately never had a customer like Malinda's, there were times that we had to replace a pup.  Never did the purchaser blame us for the defect as these were all rational people who understand that you are dealing with nature and there is no way to predict what will happen with a litter.  We usually never asked for the pup back from the good folks who were willing to take care of it and provide it with a home and care.  We sent a replacement pup or in one case took the pup back and refunded the money as the buyer was going to have her PTS.  She is now a healthy, happy 4 year old with a great family.  This is all that you can do as a breeder and Malinda has obviously stepped up and offered to do the right thing.  For the buyer to blame her for something that is totally out of her control, is unfathomable.  I am with Don Corleone on this one.  The buyer was offered a replacement at day 2 and chose to keep the pup of her own free will. 

I also have to say that Taunya and Josef Mravik are good friends of ours.  We purchased many fantastic dogs from him for our breeding program and for our clients over the years and they are honest, upstanding folks.  Taunya is very helpful and down to earth and always available to help and answer any qestions.  The knowledge that she and Josef have about the breed is vast and they have done so much to promote the breed andhelp those of us who were trying to learn more about these wonderful dogs.  To see them slandered on this board makes my blood boil.  Don't let the bastards get you down, T!

With all the slanderous, baseless blather that goes on on this board, I am so glad that we are out breeding.  I miss the dogs and always will but I always said that if you could sell the pups to other dogs and take people out of the equation, it would be the perfect avocation.  I am glad that there are still people like Malinda who obviously care greatly about the breed and what she produces.  One of these days, I plan to write a humorous treatise on the time spent breeding entitled "So You Want to Be A Dog Breeder, You Dumb ASS?"  One of the chapters will be called "Your Puppies Are Smarter Than the People Who Buy Them."  This seems to be a case in point.  Keep you chin up Malinda and think about all the great dogs you have produced and all the poeple whom you have made happy out there.  To the owner of the pup.  I feel really terrible for this little guy ad you have my sympathy but if you had taken Malinda's offer to start with, you wouldn't be in this position.  This board should not be used as a forum to air your grievances.