What exactly is a soft helper? - Page 2

DR. Well preached. this should be taken as the gospel truth."he must be able to "read" the dog. A bad helper can ruin even a good dog." Amen

realcold, truth be known, there are so many helpers, agitators or what ever you want to refer to them as, that couldn't read a dog if their life depended on it. You can see guys that are charging folks $25 every time they work a dog and they should be paying the owner for screwing the dog up. Sad part is most handlers/owners don't know enough to tell the difference between a knowledgeable helper or a wannabe.

But I will admit if you have a weak nerved dog and trying to title it you need to compete when they are using a "soft" helper as not to un-nerve or intimindate the weak nerved dog.

DR I beleive that spook was saying that these guys who screw up the dogs would totally blow these "soft" dogs to hell. I know it takes a much better helper to make the "picture" with a soft dog. A few years ago a friends dog got 99 in protection at the worlds and without his great helpers the dog would of been hard pressed to pass a club trial. Great helpers but able to go soft for the "picture" for this particular dog. Good dogs would be work hard which is normal for most of their work.

Actually I don't think that what is what he was saying but SPOOK, clarify yourself. IMO he is saying many helpers don't have the ability to read a dog and can/will screw up the dog being trained. MOST dogs while young in age and early in training need to be stressed thru a progession of steps getting stronger attacks as the dog matures. You can take a very strong nerved 9 month Male GSD and if you come on too strong too quick you can ruin him. Does not matter how good of nerves and temperment he has; a bad helper can ruin the dog until he gets past the "taboo",as I mentioned earlier that it's OK to bite the bad guy.

DR. We had this dicussion last night after training with the club. Overpowering young dogs will teach them to be quitters. This is terrible in itself but a crime when it is done to a young powerful dog. IMO this happens far more often than people realize. Spook. Up here in the frozen north no one pays for helper work. Join a club and your good to go. Sure hope it stays that way as I don't have many years left of putting the pants on. I would be pissed if after years of helping others I had to pay.

I agree 100% when your talking about an mature dog when it is ready for it. You progress as the dog is ready, all dogs progress at different rates and ages depending on alot of variables. You are right in that you should not protect and go soft on a dog competing and going for a title such as schuzthund, mondo ring etc.... I think we are saying the same thing just in different words. I recently watched a 6 month old female tear up the sleeve and was very strong nerved. She was of excellent bloodlines and had been imprinted from a pup onwards and she would have been hard to intimindiate. But you take a six month old which had little to no previous training and you would likely would have to go slower.

Let me say this about that. If you are doing helper work in a training capacity, you have to have the ability to be whatever the dog you're working needs. A lot of helpers are not capable of this because they cannot really read a dog. A lot of them fake it and most handlers don't know the difference. If you are working as a trial helper it is your obligation to present the dog in the manner the judge requires. If I were a judge and I thought a helper was going out of his way to show me other than an honest picture I would boot the helper (provided there was an alternative) and note his assistance to the organization, USA, DVG, etc.

Very important for the helper to discuss and know the training objective for each session Before the training starts.

DR. I personally never work dogs under 10 months. The only time this backfired was with a really strong dog about 8 years ago. His nerves were so strong that we never were able to get a true defensive posture from him. Working young dogs, helpers tend to use to much prey because they think that biting is everything. The danger is locking the dog in prey. My take is that you prepare the young dog with tug work and runaways for targeting by the handler only. When his time comes for his real work it is done just as darkness is falling so that he will LOAD in defence as the helper comes out of the very dark bush. Now the helper chickens out and runs away like some soft weak loser. Dog shifts to high prey and chases loser off HIS field. No more work for 2-3 weeks. This has been very sucessful for us and I should thank the people I stole it from. I know there is other ways and but this is our way.